# Mitchell 302/402 All out



## NoMoSurf

If one were to go ALL the way with a Mitchell 302/402 and do every mod, what would the full list comprise of?

HT-100 Drag
Boca Bearing
Crosswind cam (why do I want this?)
Manual Pick-up (don't want this)
Billet knob
Paint Job
Anything else?


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## ThaFish

NoMoSurf said:


> If one were to go ALL the way with a Mitchell 302/402 and do every mod, what would the full list comprise of?
> 
> HT-100 Drag
> Boca Bearing
> Crosswind cam (why do I want this?)
> Manual Pick-up (don't want this)
> Billet knob
> Paint Job
> Anything else?


There's also a way to reinforce the spool to eliminate your chance of a spool blowup (somewhat common on the 302/402 spools). I was reading about it on the stripersonline forum I think but I can't remember exactly what I read. & I believe the crosswind cam changes the oscillation to make the line lay better? Joe or Ocean Master may be able to correct me on that though..


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## Pompano Joe

*Mitchell*



ThaFish said:


> I believe the crosswind cam changes the oscillation to make the line lay better? Joe or Ocean Master may be able to correct me on that though..


That's absolutely correct. Here's an brief definition from Mitchell: _*A revolution for Mitchell was their Planamatic Gearing for the CAP reel in the early fifties. This gearing combined the best features of both the old Level-Wind and Cross-Wind for maximum line capacity and no line binding and was later used on other Mitchell reels.* _ What this doesn't tell you is that it was an epic failure. Crosswind cam is an easy fix, but I've used at least two other ways to fix the problem. One involves epoxy and the other a set screw. Both do the job, but not as clean and simple as the CW cam. 

I've had good luck with Bocca Bearings. You can also get a replacement from Smooth Drag. Wouldn't spend the extra money for ceramic or ABEC 7. Like putting a V-12 in a Vega, IMHO. You can do that, but why? It's still going to be an old Mitchell. 

The most important thing is to have fun with it and make it yours! After seeing that little 304, I can't wait to see what you come up with.


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## fairpoint

NoMoSurf said:


> If one were to go ALL the way with a Mitchell 302/402 and do every mod, what would the full list comprise of?
> 
> HT-100 Drag
> Boca Bearing
> Crosswind cam (why do I want this?)
> Manual Pick-up (don't want this)
> Billet knob
> Paint Job
> Anything else?


 Where does the boca bearing go...? I wasn't aware of the available upgrade.....
Have you ever tried to learn how to use a manual pick-up..?
Once you are accustom to them you'll be cutting off all of the bails on your reels....REEELLY,lol......
Good luck on your build and these guys are spot on about the crosswind
cam's function..and as mentioned there are multiple way of converting the planamanic to the crosswind configuration.....
A fad back in the eighties was to have a plexiglass sideplate ....pretty cool watching the gears work inside...maybe an option for you....


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## ThaFish

fairpoint said:


> Where does the boca bearing go...? I wasn't aware of the available upgrade.....
> Have you ever tried to learn how to use a manual pick-up..?
> Once you are accustom to them you'll be cutting off all of the bails on your reels....REEELLY,lol......
> Good luck on your build and these guys are spot on about the crosswind
> cam's function..and as mentioned there are multiple way of converting the planamanic to the crosswind configuration.....
> A fad back in the eighties was to have a plexiglass sideplate ....pretty cool watching the gears work inside...maybe an option for you....


I think the boca goes on the pinion gear. & I've never heard of the plexiglass sideplate. That'd be awesome! Probably wouldn't be too expensive to get a small piece of plexiglass & make one of those..


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## NoMoSurf

Thanks for the input guys. I didn't want to go through all of the trouble to mod these reels only to have someone say "you went to all that trouble, why didn't you _____"

I know what the crosswind cam does, but in playing with my 402 last night (just got it) it looks like it has a pretty effective action already. So I was just curious.

As for the manual pick-up. I used on once. I didn't care for it and so seldom have a bail close that I don't want to spend the $100 to do it. I would try to use Mitchell original parts. I've seen the cheaper PUM kits, but have read that they are not all that great. Plus, my wife will be using these as much as I do. I don't think she would like it either. We'll see. If bails slamming closed turns out to be a problem, I can add it to the list of things to do.

The plexi side plate is an interesting idea. I used to work a great deal in plexi and acrylic, so it would be a snap to do. But I think keeping the inside clean of grease and oil splatter would really mess with my OCD. Maybe if I build one as a shelf queen.


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## ThaFish

NoMoSurf said:


> .
> 
> The plexi side plate is an interesting idea. I used to work a great deal in plexi and acrylic, so it would be a snap to do. But I think keeping the inside clean of grease and oil splatter would really mess with my OCD. Maybe if I build one as a shelf queen.


Just a shot in the dark here but could you possibly try making one of these plexiglass sideplates for a 302 for me? A buddy of mine & I are doing a resto/custom 302 right now & I think that the plexiglass sideplate would be a really cool idea!


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## Pompano Joe

I'm sure NoMo would do a much better job, but you can cut one yourself by tracing a side plate on plexiglas, rough cutting with a dremel, then sanding to make adjustments. Faitpoint and I are obviously dating ourselves, but I remember when every Penn I fished had the plexi side plate.


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## NoMoSurf

ThaFish said:


> Just a shot in the dark here but could you possibly try making one of these plexiglass sideplates for a 302 for me? A buddy of mine & I are doing a resto/custom 302 right now & I think that the plexiglass sideplate would be a really cool idea!


I don't suppose that would be a problem. It would only take about 5-10 minutes. I don't have any plexi though. If you could get some to me, I would have no problem doing it for you.

I tell you what would be REALLY tight! To get a Mitchell logo sticker cut in reverse, apply to inside of plate and then "frost" it. Then remove sticker.



ThaFish said:


> There's also a way to reinforce the spool to eliminate your chance of a spool blowup (somewhat common on the 302/402 spools).


I've looked all over Stripers.com as well as the rest of the internet. I couldn't find anything about this. My 302/402 spools seen VERY sturdy, so I cant imagine one coming apart. now, the spool on that 304 is a different story. It is several pieces of aluminum stamped and riveted together. Can you post a link to the discussion that you were talking about?


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## MoganMan

Plexi-glass sideplates? I know what I'm doing to my 302's!


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## NoMoSurf

MoganMan said:


> Plexi-glass sideplates? I know what I'm doing to my 302's!


Looks like someone started a trend... :thumbup:


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## fairpoint

Alrights BOYS you got me going......this conversion has been done but I AM the one that came up with it ....I don't care what anybody has to say.....
This conversion is for powerpro strength without blowing up a main or pinion gear....
What you do is obtain a geared sideplate .....grind the stem that engages either ther planamanic or crosswind cam...all the way flush.....take off opposite side plate of reel
you wantin to upgrade.....Put your newly worked on sideplate and Time the anti-rverse to be in sync.....Use the longer screws to install this section back on reel....
What this configuration does is that it captures the pinion gear where there can be no play......which is the cause of failure with these reels......You also have Double drag
dogs beefing up the anti-reverse.......more to come......


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## NoMoSurf

fairpoint said:


> Alrights BOYS you got me going......this conversion has been done but I AM the one that came up with it ....I don't care what anybody has to say.....
> This conversion is for powerpro strength without blowing up a main or pinion gear....
> What you do is obtain a geared sideplate .....grind the stem that engages either ther planamanic or crosswind cam...all the way flush.....take off opposite side plate of reel
> you wantin to upgrade.....Put your newly worked on sideplate and Time the anti-rverse to be in sync.....Use the longer screws to install this section back on reel....
> What this configuration does is that it captures the pinion gear where there can be no play......which is the cause of failure with these reels......You also have Double drag
> dogs beefing up the anti-reverse.......more to come......


Got any pics of this? I'm not following you...


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## ThaFish

MoganMan said:


> Plexi-glass sideplates? I know what I'm doing to my 302's!


You copying SOB! Haha. Just kidding man. I'm definitely gonna do that though.


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## Pompano Joe

fairpoint said:


> .......more to come......


Would love some pics of the modified side plate. I've seen on of these on the pier and understand the concept...but I've never seen one apart.


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## fairpoint

All it is is a sideplate,main gear,with the anti-reverse.....You have to sacrifice the main gear by grinding out the 1/4" post that's on the face of it ....the reason you do that is so the football looking part that's on the spool shaft won't hit it.....You're actually putting two main gears in the reel.....after you get it together you can grind down shaft and sideplate so it won't stick out so far on the side that you don't have a handle on.....fyi this will not work on a 402 because the gears ar cut spiral bevel....The reason it will work on a 302 is because the teeth on the main and pinion are straight.......I told Ferd about this and we went for bigger and better so it kinda went the wayside until I see OBee on the Pensacola BP fishing with one.....


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## mitchell master

Just go on the bay and buy a brass crosswind cam for 10.00


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## NoMoSurf

OK. THAT'S were I lost you. I didn't realize you were saying to keep the second main gear. At that point I was second guessing that you were talking about using a left cover plat on the right side.

I bet that sucker sure does chatter with 2 anti reverse dogs!


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## fairpoint

The key here is to have dogs in sync....then you have double the strength....if they are not then its just like using one......follow me...?


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## mitchell master

fairpoint said:


> The key here is to have dogs in sync....then you have double the strength....if they are not then its just like using one......follow me...?


Fairpoint what does the tail end of the 2nd anti reverse dog rest on ?i know the fist one rests on the cam of the lever thanks


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## fairpoint

each sideplate on each side of the reel will have a main gear,anti-rverse switch,dog.....you won't have two dogs on one side....hope that helps....


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## mitchell master

fairpoint said:


> each sideplate on each side of the reel will have a main gear,anti-rverse switch,dog.....you won't have two dogs on one side....hope that helps....


Thanks i understand now i never tried that setup but always open to new ideas.


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## fairpoint

I only showed one friend of mine the setup and it showed up on the pier a year later.....very few know about this setup.....


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## ThaFish

NoMoSurf said:


> I don't suppose that would be a problem. It would only take about 5-10 minutes. I don't have any plexi though. If you could get some to me, I would have no problem doing it for you.
> 
> I tell you what would be REALLY tight! To get a Mitchell logo sticker cut in reverse, apply to inside of plate and then "frost" it. Then remove sticker.
> 
> 
> 
> I've looked all over Stripers.com as well as the rest of the internet. I couldn't find anything about this. My 302/402 spools seen VERY sturdy, so I cant imagine one coming apart. now, the spool on that 304 is a different story. It is several pieces of aluminum stamped and riveted together. Can you post a link to the discussion that you were talking about?


So if I could bring you the plexiglass you could do it? I don't know much about it so what thickness/type should I get? I suppose I'd have to get the same thickness as the stock sideplate but I'm not sure I guess. 

& I'll look for that discussion that I was talking about the other day. I was just reading it within the past week so I should be able to find it.


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## NoMoSurf

Sure. I would think some 1/8 or 3/16 would be best.

Keep in mind, I live in Montgomery, AL

Was it about the spool blowing up or just the drag screw being removed and the drag washers blowing out?
I asked about it on the big mitchell forum. No one had ever heard of it. Except for the drag washers springing out.


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## fairpoint

spools are made from potmetal ....when spooling on new line with a machine don't pack it on super tight.....I've blown spools up fighting jack crevalle with the drag almost locked down......To remove the spool without total dismantling tighten drag all the way....then thenhold both spool and drag knob and quickly spin it off....You will get line under the spool periodically and this trick will save your day....if your spool won't come off withthis procedure,then after you dismantle the spool put some grease on the thread of the shaft and you 'll be ready the next time.....


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## NoMoSurf

fairpoint said:


> spools are made from potmetal I've blown spools up fighting jack crevalle with the drag almost locked down......
> 
> 
> 
> Please explain. The spool actually comes apart? Or the just the drag comes apart. I know how to remove the spool without taking the drag apart. I'm just trying to figure out if this is some sort of catastrophic failure, or just the drag disassembling itself.
Click to expand...


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## fairpoint

The upper portion of the spool will crack from the pressure of the line being stacked
too tight....The old penn 706's spools would blow up also until the anodized spools were made......the lip will just come up about 1/2 inch or so....drag washers will stay inside......I have to laugh when I see these guys drilling the spool to be cool....they're just making it weaker.....and when these spools expand/fail they will lock the reel up and you're done.......


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## Squidder

*Dual Gear 302*

Hey Master,
I have been making dual gear 302s for years. They do work well and take the pressure off the pinion bearing and keep the spool axel straight. I have a friend who has one I built and loves Tarpon ripping with it!

Rick C



mitchell master said:


> Thanks i understand now i never tried that setup but always open to new ideas.


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## Squidder

*Side Plates*

NoMoSurf,
If you are looking for Smoked and clear Polycarbonite sideplates, I have been making and selling them for years. Broxon's Outdoors in Navarre sells them for me also. If you make one, make sure you groove it to the body and seal it with clear 3145RTV sealant or water will intrude. I commonly have the Cobia laser etched plates or the King Mackeral plates.

Rick C.



NoMoSurf said:


> Looks like someone started a trend... :thumbup:


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## NoMoSurf

Squidder said:


> NoMoSurf,
> If you are looking for Smoked and clear Polycarbonite sideplates, I have been making and selling them for years. Broxon's Outdoors in Navarre sells them for me also. If you make one, make sure you groove it to the body and seal it with clear 3145RTV sealant or water will intrude. I commonly have the Cobia laser etched plates or the King Mackeral plates.
> 
> Rick C.


I didn't want one, but ThaFish was looking for me to build him one. It would probably be better to get from you, since you are local and have perfected them. I'd be starting from scratch.

But I do have a question! When double gearing one of these, how much of the main gear axle do you need to leave for it to be effective? I'm gonna want to cut it off as flush as possible and weld the hole over.


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## Squidder

I leave in about 3/8 inch. If you don't leave in enough, the 2nd gear will bind under pressure. Trial and error did it for me. I make a little round cap out of .050 aluminum and tap four sides of the cut sideplate sleeve to screw the cap on for easy lubrication. All I do is seal it in place and then wipe off excess after dry before the final assembly. The last one I built used a dime as the cap. 

Rick C.


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## NoMoSurf

Well, I just double geared/double dogged my 302. Man that thing makes a hell of a clatter now. And yes the dogs are synched. But is sure feels like a tank now! Heavy, solid, and the gears feel great. I just have to grind the handle post and gear, then do all of the other custom stuff listed in the first post in this thread. Haha

I have started on my 402 first. I have the housing parts in paint stripper, but am not having much luck with that. I have the PUM and crosswind on the way and will get the Boca Bearing on my next paycheck. When I get it done, I'll start on the 302. I found the complete 302 sideplate on ebay and had to jump on it. When it arrived, I had to get it working.


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## fairpoint

If it too loud for your liking just put some grease around the dogs instant hushpuppies,lol.........


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## NoMoSurf

fairpoint said:


> If it too loud for your liking just put some grease around the dogs instant hushpuppies,lol.........


 
I don't know. I kinda like the clatter. It sounds like business. haha If it was going to be a cast and reel back setup, I would get tired of it. But this is going to be a large bait soaker setup. It


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## cajun creationz

ive done a few plexy sidplates ...also just flat aluminum side plates ...also flat alumium side plates cover with abalone..give me a minute i will put up some pics


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## NoMoSurf

cajun creationz said:


> ive done a few plexy sidplates ...also just flat aluminum side plates ...also flat alumium side plates cover with abalone..give me a minute i will put up some pics


I'm double gearing both of mine, but I would like to see the abalone plates. :thumbup:


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## cajun creationz

here are a couple


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## yerbyray

*Boca Bearing*

Does anyone know what size I would need for this? I honestly don't know much about measuring bearings but I do have some familiarization with the ABEC ratings.

Thanks


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## Les_Garten

So for you guys who build the "Double 302"

The Main gear on the right side is an "idler gear"? It does not drive, is that correct? It just idles and helps prevent the deflection of the pinion and shaft?


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## NoMoSurf

Les_Garten said:


> So for you guys who build the "Double 302"
> 
> The Main gear on the right side is an "idler gear"? It does not drive, is that correct? It just idles and helps prevent the deflection of the pinion and shaft?


Exactly. Apparently this is a problem with these reels. I never have experienced it. But then again, I have never caught anything that would cause it. Maybe one day... Soon... :whistling:


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## Les_Garten

NoMoSurf said:


> Exactly. Apparently this is a problem with these reels. I never have experienced it. But then again, I have never caught anything that would cause it. Maybe one day... Soon... :whistling:


I wonder how much it adds to the cranking effort?


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## NoMoSurf

None. It is a free wheeling gear.


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