# Lionfish Population Control Proposal



## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Hi all you PFF spearo's

Just wanted to give you a heads-up. The Emerald Coast Reef Association has a proposal that if passed would reward lionfish hunters with 10 native fish tags as follows: 

2 Red Snapper Tags
2 Red Grouper Tags
2 Gag Grouper Tags
2 Grey Triggerfish Tags
2 Greater Amberjack Tags

These reward tags would be good in-or-out of season. ECRA has a petition on thier website and we are asking for your signature. Everyone that signs the petition will be an important part of helping us to get this proposal implemented. For those of you who have already signed it, Thank you so much for your support! 

Sign the petition here: http://www.gopetition.com/petitions...l-and-the-search-for-eradication-methods.html

Here is a Tri-fold brochure that explains the Proposal in detail: http://www.ecreef.org/Documents/4.19.15 Proposal Hand-out Brochure Lionfish Tri Fold Brochure.pdf 

Everyone, please feel free to share this link on all your social media sites and be sure to ask them to click on it and sign the petition. 

ECRA is working hard for the benefit of our fishery AND we always work hard to look out for you too! Together with your help, we can get this done. 

Thanks for your support!


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## TONER (Mar 25, 2008)

Wow love it hope it goes through
i was #491


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## JD7.62 (Feb 13, 2008)

What about the people that don't dive for.what ever reason? I want to harvest fish out of season but I don't dive. 

Not to mention it'll cost way more than just the cost of the tags. what about the people that staff the drop off locations and the logistics involved with documenting who gets what?


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## BananaTom (Feb 16, 2008)

I Guess I already signed. Went to do it, and it said I can not sign twice


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## ThaFish (Feb 27, 2013)

JD7.62 said:


> What about the people that don't dive for.what ever reason? I want to harvest fish out of season but I don't dive.


Guess you've gotta figure out a way to efficiently harvest lionfish via hook & line.


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## whome (Oct 2, 2007)

JD7.62 said:


> What about the people that don't dive for.what ever reason? I want to harvest fish out of season but I don't dive.
> 
> Not to mention it'll cost way more than just the cost of the tags. what about the people that staff the drop off locations and the logistics involved with documenting who gets what?



I agree


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## TONER (Mar 25, 2008)

JD7.62 said:


> What about the people that don't dive for.what ever reason? I want to harvest fish out of season but I don't dive.
> 
> Not to mention it'll cost time way more than just cost of the tags. what about the people that staff the drop off locations and the logistics involved with documenting who gets what?[/ ]
> 
> That is a very selfish uneducated opinion the population of lionfish over the past year alone has exploded in the northern Gulf of Mexico there needs to be some type of incentive because they are time consuming to harvest and when you are diving time is very limited if something isn't done you're not going to have to worry about getting tags for your fish because lionfish will have eatin all the smaller fish so until a better way of harvesting them comes along this is the best plan out there as a fisherman you enjoy going fishing you really should consider signing this petition


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Nobody on this forum needs to worry about the logistics. The Emerald Coast Reef Association is going to make all the arrangements. Our organization is experienced in accomplishing big things at a very low cost.


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## ThaFish (Feb 27, 2013)

JD7.62 said:


> Not to mention it'll cost way more than just the cost of the tags. what about the people that staff the drop off locations and the logistics involved with documenting who gets what?


Right, because it would make PERFECT sense to assume that considerations for the logistics costs pertaining to this operation wouldn't have been made prior to the creation of this petition...

& what about the people that would be required to staff the drop-off locations? God forbid that new (& actually productive) jobs are created via the passing of the petition!


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Great News everybody! We have over 500 signatures! Would love to have more. If you haven't already signed the petition, I encourage you to do so.

For all those who have already signed, I thank you very much!


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## jspooney (Oct 2, 2007)

signed


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## Mac1528 (Mar 24, 2012)

Like it...they even send you a receipt to manage your signature!


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Thanks for your support jspooney and Mac1528 and everyone else that is helping to make this happen. 

Please Feel free to share the link with all your buddies and your family and ask them to click and sign the petition too! There is strength in numbers and together, we will get this done.

http://www.gopetition.com/petitions...l-and-the-search-for-eradication-methods.html


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## JD7.62 (Feb 13, 2008)

TONER said:


> JD7.62 said:
> 
> 
> > What about the people that don't dive for.what ever reason? I want to harvest fish out of season but I don't dive.
> ...


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## Mac1528 (Mar 24, 2012)

Hey, here's a unique concept!







You can also catch them on a rod & reel I'm told!


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## JD7.62 (Feb 13, 2008)

Sweet. So if I catch them on rod and reel I get tags for out of season fish too?!


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## Mac1528 (Mar 24, 2012)

Why not...the proposal just states you turn in 100 frozen lionfish heads...you get 10 tags. It's a stretch but I don't believe it excludes anyone. Maybe I'm wrong.


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Nobody is excluded. 

We would be delighted to have fishermen earning reward tags! As a matter of fact, that would be a dream come true as it would increase the army to fight this invader!

Yes, there have been multiple scientific studies that show the lionfish ARE eating our native fish at unsustainable rates. One LF can eat up to 65 fish in a single feeding. When LF show up on a reef, biodiversity is reduced very quickly. 

Think of lionfish like termites, they can't be seen by fishermen but they are causing serious damage to our fishery. Some people won't believe it until our fishery collapses the same way you sometimes find out your wall has termites when it falls down.

This program will benefit all fishermen because it will save 1.6 million of our native fish each month those 25 thousand LF are out of the water.


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## TONER (Mar 25, 2008)

Picture taken 20 miles out of Pensacola every private reef in over 80' deep looks like that without divers cleaning them off ! Don't believe me let me know when you want to go out !
They are eating machines.


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## Addict'd (May 17, 2009)

JD7.62 said:


> TONER said:
> 
> 
> > Selfish and uneducated?! Maybe its just me, but getting the government use to the idea of having to do something in order to get something (tags) just doesnt sit right with me. Whats next, will I have to clean up the beach one weekend a month to get my pinfish tags?!
> ...


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## skram (Dec 25, 2007)

Signed! Theres no way that the scuba guys that take 200+ lionfish a day aren't making an impact on those reefs. This helps everyone.


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## JD7.62 (Feb 13, 2008)

So let me get this straight. You want to turn in lionfish that you guys say should be killed anyway to get tags for fish that are out of season which you are trying to protect by killing lionfish?!

I never said they shouldnt be killed. What Im saying is, lets call this what it is, an excuse to get special privileges.

My last post on this thread. Its not going to pass anyhow so really we are arguing over a moot point.


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## jspooney (Oct 2, 2007)

JD7.62 said:


> So let me get this straight. You want to turn in lionfish that you guys say should be killed anyway to get tags for fish that are out of season which you are trying to protect by killing lionfish?!
> 
> I never said they shouldnt be killed. What Im saying is, lets call this what it is, an excuse to get special privileges.
> 
> My last post on this thread. Its not going to pass anyhow so really we are arguing over a moot point.


Not exactly. We're not talking about a one to one ratio. One lionfish will eat thousands of fry. Multiply that by thousands of lionfish and you can see the damage.


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## Big B (Sep 7, 2009)

I can't believe all of you are supporting this petition. What did those poor lion fish ever do to you. I don't see them signing a petition to have your kind eradicated. Maybe you should mind your own business and let them be. Just kidding, I signed the petition because I think it is a great idea.


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## TONER (Mar 25, 2008)

Candy have you thought about just trying for making it legal to possess 1 out of season fish for 20 lionfish on board? Seems like it would be a lot more simple. No need to have people to check them in or have to make tags.


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## SaltAddict (Jan 6, 2010)

Petition signed. 

I just about don't participate on this forum anymore because there's a hater on every thread. 
Last I checked, anyone physically able can get certified to dive. This is a step in the right direction.


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## rscrubberrn (Apr 24, 2015)

I like your proposal toner, seems to be a lot easier to control. As for the people that think you can just hook and line them lets see where you have caught a 100 of them on any one trip. It just doesn't happen. We were out diving last week and had the privilege of watching a couple of assholes catching fish after fish and tossing them right back over board without popping their air bladder. You guessed it every fish died and the sharks moved in. What's wrong with letting divers doing something good have a little perk.


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## CurDog (Nov 14, 2010)

TONER said:


> Candy have you thought about just trying for making it legal to possess 1 out of season fish for 20 lionfish on board? Seems like it would be a lot more simple. No need to have people to check them in or have to make tags.


Yup, I 2nd this... Except it should be 2-Tags per 20... This, I think, would keep the interest up more, and would help the people boat fishing, as their catch ratio would be lower than that of a diver. And besides, If you get 10 Tags per 100, it equals the same as 2 Tags per 20 Lionfish... :yes:


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Ok Everyone,

Yesterday, I went to the FFWCC meeting in Panama City. It was a very long day. I left my home around 7:15 and got home around 9:30pm.

I delivered all of your signatures as well as letters of support provided by politicians, many businesses in the Panhandle, non-profit organizations and one very well known and respected scientist.

Below is the table of contents from the package delivered to the Commissioners. I will be in touch with the folks at the FWC next week, after they have had time to read the letters. 

Please be sure to thank the businesses that provided letters of support for this effort. If your business or organization would like to add a letter of support, I will gladly deliver it to all the Commissioners and the Governor next week. This is one of those times where more really is better! The letter needs to be addressed to the FFWCC and Governor Scott and sent to me as a pdf. Be sure to mention that you support the plan and sign your letter. If you have a business letterhead, that is a nice touch. If not, no worries. Send letters of support to: [email protected] 

Stay tuned. 


*Table of Contents:*

Introduction & Proposal Summary

2015 FWC funded statewide survey results showing stakeholder attitudes towards fishery management in regards to the lionfish crisis 

Letters of Support for ECRA’s Pilot Program Proposal
State Senator Don Gaetz
State Representative Matt Gaetz
Dr. Robert Shipp, Dolphin Island Sea Lab
Capt. Kelly Windes, Vice Chairman Okaloosa County Commission
Ryan Hinely, Executive Director, Marine Industries Association NWF
Dewey Destin, Dewey Destin’s Seafood Restaurants – Destin, FL 
Jim Tucker, The Boat Yard & Marina
Capt. Andy Lowe, Owner Lionfish Hunting Manufacturer & Retail Sales
Capt. Gregg Velez, Owner Diving Deep LLC
Andy McAlexander, President Walton County Artificial Reef Association
John Dyer, President Fort Walton Beach Sailfish Club
Dive Shops/Charters Escambia County 
Scuba Shack – Pensacola, FL
Viking Diving – Pensacola, FL
MBT Divers – Pensacola, FL 
*Dive Shop Santa Rosa County
*Bay Breeze Dive Center - Gulf Breeze, FL 
*Dive Shops/Charters Okaloosa County
*Discovery Dive World –Valparaiso, FL
Scuba Tech – Destin, FL
Emerald Coast Scuba – Destin, FL
Divers Emporium – Crestview, FL
*Dive Shop Walton County
*Red 7 Scuba – DeFuniak Springs, FL 
*Dive Shops/Charters Bay County
*Dive Locker – Panama City Beach, FL
Divers Den – Panama City Beach, FL
*Petition with over 500 stakeholder signatures (Front folder pocket) 

*


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Oh and one more thing, we are leaving our petition open for signatures until we get this program implemented.

If you haven't signed it and would like to be part of the movement to save our fishery, go here: http://www.gopetition.com/petitions...l-and-the-search-for-eradication-methods.html

Feel free to share on your social media sites and make sure you ask them to click on the link AND sign the petition. 

A million thanks to everyone for their amazing support.


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Hi Toner,
Yes, the FWC wanted to have a way to track how many fish were taken and what species. The only way I could come up with to provide that information was tags. The tags will allow fishery managers to have an accurate count of the number of lionfish removed every month and know exactly how many and what species of native fish may be taken.

I agree, simple is better. This plan is still pretty darn simple. Kill 100 lionfish, turn in their heads, get 10 native fish tags.


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## TONER (Mar 25, 2008)

Candy said:


> Hi Toner,
> Yes, the FWC wanted to have a way to track how many fish were taken and what species. The only way I could come up with to that information was tags. The tags will allow fishery managers to have an accurate count of the number of lionfish removed every month and know exactly how many and what species of native fish may be taken.
> 
> I agree, simple is better. This plan is still pretty darn simple. Kill 100 lionfish, turn in their heads, get 10 native fish tags.


Great job candy we really appreciate all your efforts I figured this had to have been an option there was something that required you to come up with the tag plan thanks again


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Thanks Toner! I appreciate you and everyone who has been supportive.


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## Njydvr (Jan 1, 2008)

Just signed, #526


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## Capt'n Daddy (Oct 10, 2014)

Signed...good work. Will be diving lots more next year


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Thanks everyone for your continued support! Keep those signatures coming.

I would also like to thank Dive Pro's for providing us with a letter of support. Their excellent letter has been sent to Tallahassee.

I'll keep you all informed on the progress. As I'm sure you all know, the wheels of government move slowly.


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## Dynamic (Oct 3, 2007)

Signed. Number 530. This makes me want to dive more next year!!!


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Hi everyone,

Here is an article that pretty much backs up what I have been saying for several years. Commercialization will not work!

http://www.takepart.com/article/2015/10/27/eating-invasives 


Here’s are some quotes from the article: 

Duane Chapman, a fish biologist with the U.S. Geological Survey and an expert on the nonnative Asian carp, noted that dining on aggressive foreign species has never been done effectively. “*It hasn’t been used anywhere in the world that I know of to effectively control an invasive species,” he said*.

****************
The restaurateur and entrepreneur Chadwick is also trying, but so far, he’s had no luck. Chadwick’s commitment to the cause runs deeper still. He’s part owner of Lionfish Atlantic, the only dedicated lionfish distributor in the country. He serves lionfish at three of his other restaurants: another in New York, one in Aspen, and a third in Nantucket, Massachusetts.
“I’m trying to do all I can,” he said, sitting in the dining room of Norman’s Cay just before the dinner rush. He wants more people to eat the destructive invasive. But when he reflected on the costs of hunting and preparing lionfish, he was somber. *“I don’t think we’ll ever make money on lionfish,” he said.*


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## Billybob+ (Jul 12, 2011)

I've been watching this thread for a few weeks trying to convince myself not to chime in but maybe I'm just bored or hard-headed....or both.

anyway. Here goes.

I dive probably as much as most of the recreational divers on here and here's my thoughts.

I personally can not sign the petition.

here's why.

if you got every rec diver on every dive to kill 100 each it wouldn't do anything to SIGNIFICANTLY reduce the infestation. They are here to stay and guess who will solve the problem? the Gulf and Nature itself will. Probably by everything reaching a homeostasis but perhaps some parasitic or bacterial combatant pops up that the Lionfish are suceptalbe to.

Now I'd LOVE to have the extra fish to shoot! heck yeah! and I don't mean to be discouraging to you because should you succeed (you won't and I'll explain later why) I will be the FIRST in line to submit my 100 a week!
Oh, and many of us are already killing all we care to clean now so I'm not sure that your plan will even increase the "delta" taken by divers.

Here's my problem with the whole "chicken little, the sky is falling" 
It will and even has become a platform by which people can dupe other people, all in the name of "saving us from lionfish!" 

Add to that, the geniuses at NMFS will soon figure out they have to reduce the rec fishermans catch by even greater numbers to recover the fish lost to these "invaders" (as most of the "chicken little" folks espouse)


As far as your plan ever being implemented, well, unless you go with something similar to "Toners" suggestion it'll never happen. Your plan calls for either A. Government workers taking on additional duties/responsibilities ( I hope it's intuitively obvious why A won't work)
or B. increased expenditures for a "new program". which there is no revenue here to support that so I HOPE B would fail (though our genius elected officials don't mind spending money they don't have, especially if it belongs to someone else.) 

can I propose something else though? 

Make it where I can sell my tags to the rec H&L guys. :whistling:

Oh well, if nothing else, I gave you a bump


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## Candy (Jan 6, 2008)

Billybob,

I appreciate the concern you have about the costs to taxpayers and I share those concerns with you. 

Anyway, As far as costs to the taxpayers and this proposal: The Emerald Coast Reef Association has offered to run the program *at no cost to the FWC other than them providing tags.* 

ECRA has access to a freezer where we will store all 25,000 lionfish heads until the pilot program is completed. That will provide absolute proof that the program was run with integrity.

Nobody will be given tags, they will have to earn them. To earn them, divers will spend their own time, their own money, spear at their on risk (stings, sharks, etc...) and remove the heads for turn-in.

We are asking for a biologically insignificant number of fish that will have zero effect on seasons for any sector. 

As far as nature taking care of itself...well, that sounds great but the lionfish invasion hasn't shown that theory to be correct, just the opposite. The situation is getting worse every day and has for the past 3 decades. You've only seen 5 years of invasion. Has it begun to get better or is the problem getting worse?


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## dthomas142 (Jul 18, 2011)

Signed, #542


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## Deeplines (Sep 28, 2007)

My biggest fear is this is the 1st step into buying tags to keep any of our fish. 

I like the idea though but think it should be 100 fish you get one tag and you choice which fish. (Grouper, red snapper or which ever tag you want.)

Who cares what it costs you, you are doing it anyways and for those that are doing it they are rewarded a little. 

Like Billybob said, THIS WILL BE USED AGAINST THE REC. FISHERMAN soon or later. More likely sooner if this goes through.

I don't dive and really have no dog in the fight. I hardly even fish anymore with all the things that need to be done on the boat, nothing is ever in season that long and work. 

Just like when I went to the meeting Long time ago over the red snapper thing. I told them yea, I could live off two snapper a day. Heck I could catch them pretty easy even back then. Next thing I know it's 2 snapper for 90 days, now its 2 snapper for a week. After this it will 0 snapper for 0 days.

Sounds good but to me it seems like a road I wish we didn't go down. Best example I can think of that this compares to is Affordable Health Care. 

There is a reason NRA tries to keep the Government for nibbling at the gun rights. I don't care for the assault rifles thing but get folks to give up something and the hook is in. Just start chopping away after that till nothing is left. Even though I don't think a person really needs a assault rifle for hunting I think she should have the right to have one to keep the government to closing the whole gun right issue. 

What I'm saying is this is going to lead in my opinion to us buy every fish we catch buy having to buy tags.


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