# Wich van staal should I buy for catching kings off the pier?



## sabinelakehustler

Which van staal? Bail or bailless? I like it light!


----------



## atlantacapt

none of them...much smoother reels out there...their drags are not great.


----------



## Austin

Bailess or Bailed is pretty much your preference, though I and most prefer bailess. Typical size is the 200, though I have seen a few 150's used.


----------



## billin

*Stella*

It's a better real smooth drag and its easy to find get a 6000 and spool it with 65 lbs power pro its all you will need for the pier and if you buy a Terez rod it's all the bottom combo you will need here as well


----------



## fairpoint

Get a 250 manual and learn to fish with it if you HAVE to have a van staal.....You can catch most fish that swim by there....During cobia season put a top shot of 50lb powerpro braid on and you are good to go.....I'm old school and fish with a 498 Mitchell and my drag sucks but I make it work for me...A penn 706 would be good for anything on the pier as well.....For the novice maybe a penn 850 or 8500 whichever one they are putting out these days would be another suitable rig just have to keep up maint. on the line roller......good luck with your next reel 
Fairpoint


----------



## Sammy

Off the pier, light and great drag? Shimano sustain 5k fg. I have a vs150 silver laying around you can have for $500.


----------



## albacized

Only buy a Van Staal if you plan on dunking it and dragging it through the sand on the beach. Otherwise, as mentioned above, the Shimano Stella would be a good choice, if spending big bucks is the choice...And where Shimano introduced an updated version of the Stella, you can probably find a deal on the now discontinued model (that's what I did - I just picked up the 5000 SW for about $150 off the listed price)


----------



## sabinelakehustler

Thanks for the info. I currently have a sustain 10000fg with 40lb suffix 832. And a sustain 8000fe with 40lb suffix 832 also. I was wanting VS, because I swear every single person has at least 2 VS. saw one guy with 4. Never fished with one b4.


----------



## sabinelakehustler

On the pier.


----------



## Austin

Go to the tackle shops and play around with one for a bit, also see if someone out on the pier will let you try one out for a second. Then make your own decision.


----------



## southern yakker

sabinelakehustler said:


> Thanks for the info. I currently have a sustain 10000fg with 40lb suffix 832. And a sustain 8000fe with 40lb suffix 832 also. I was wanting VS, because I swear every single person has at least 2 VS. saw one guy with 4. Never fished with one b4.


Don't buy one because everyone else has one. If you like it go for it but there is reels that are just as goid on the pier for a lot cheaper!


----------



## Sammy

sabinelakehustler said:


> Thanks for the info. I currently have a sustain 10000fg with 40lb suffix 832. And a sustain 8000fe with 40lb suffix 832 also. I was wanting VS, because I swear every single person has at least 2 VS. saw one guy with 4. Never fished with one b4.


Unless you gonna dunk it like I do, stick with shimano. Get a Stella 5ksw and call it a day.


----------



## lowprofile

VS is NOT a pier reel! lol. holy sheesus. target them by wading on the second bar and you can consider a Van staal. 

get a stella. or learn to use conventional and get a calcutta 250.


----------



## Gump

Why don't you just buy one of the new 706 Penns that are coming back out. You can buy 3 or 4 for the price of that VS. Plus,... I have used both, and I take the 706 over the VS any day. I actually sold my VS simply because it was the worst feeling reel I had ever used.


----------



## fairpoint

Gump I hadn't heard that Penn was going to make another 706 run...good maybe it will drive the VS prices down a little....they were crazy at 500.00 when they first came out and now...Come on Man WTH......
Fairpoint


----------



## startzc

Just bought a Spheros 18000 with the manual bail kit totaled $200. I have since added a silver power handle sphere($25 custom fitted coutesy of pompano joe). I am not using it for any surf fishing just the pier and I like it better than my 706, the VSs I have tried on the pier. They are nice, just not $600 nice. And I wore down a 90lb shark my first fish on that new reel. It is heavier than the nice drilled out VSs but I am only 32, a few ounce wont kill me. I love my shimano and upgrade to a better shimano later but for the pier, the Spheros/Saragosas are fine for me.


----------



## Fishermon

buy it man...you have to have one so you can get it over with. YOu will love it till you get bored baby sitting that thing everywhere you go, pier specially.... then u can sell it. buy one used...It is like putting money on the bank. You can always sell it and gain your money back.


----------



## Sammy

startzc said:


> Just bought a Spheros 18000 with the manual bail kit totaled $200. I have since added a silver power handle sphere($25 custom fitted coutesy of pompano joe). I am not using it for any surf fishing just the pier and I like it better than my 706, the VSs I have tried on the pier. They are nice, just not $600 nice. And I wore down a 90lb shark my first fish on that new reel. It is heavier than the nice drilled out VSs but I am only 32, a few ounce wont kill me. I love my shimano and upgrade to a better shimano later but for the pier, the Spheros/Saragosas are fine for me.


Whoa. 18000 size for the pier?


----------



## richm0nd

Look at me, I'm fishing from a pier with a van stall.
I catch 10x more fish from my yak with my penns and mitchells


----------



## Randall2point0

Wirelessly posted

Yep Penn will release the 706z sometime between September-November and I have heard the price rage will be in the $200-250 range.


----------



## startzc

Sammy said:


> Whoa. 18000 size for the pier?


I had the money to buy one reel for everything, so I figured go big or go home. I love it though. I will eventually get different shimanos for specific fishing. But unless my wife loses her mind and buys one for me I wont pay $500 for a reel. I would rather buy a new 706 and get it customized.


----------



## fishnhuntguy

*Shimano*

Buy the one made by shimano. You will be happier with the price. Good Luck.


----------



## AVIDfisherman

I think they have a model called POS get that one. Or invest in a spinfisher V


----------



## missplaced_idahoan

startzc said:


> I had the money to buy one reel for everything, so I figured go big or go home. I love it though. I will eventually get different shimanos for specific fishing. But unless my wife loses her mind and buys one for me I wont pay $500 for a reel. I would rather buy a new 706 and get it customized.


go penn unless you are wading in 8' of water. don't waste your money on van stalls!


----------



## missplaced_idahoan

it makes you look as cool as putting a "salt life" sticker on your car.... I immediately mark you off as a douche and refuse to talk to you


----------



## BowChamp

sabinelakehustler said:


> Which van staal? Bail or bailless? I like it light!


What kind and lb. test of fishing line are you going to be using.


----------



## billfishhead

an old green 706 outta work


----------



## Ocean Master

I have worked on allot of different reels over my years. I'm 58 years old and the Van Stall uses one of the oldest designs a fishing reel can have. Yes it's a "machine shop reel" meaning it's all machined aluminum but they are heavy and slow. You can open one up and it's the same old main and pinion gear. No big deal..!! The only thing new about them is designing the water proof seals into the machining process. 

My son and his friends use them and I have tried but they are not for me. And yes at one time I was a pier rat..!!


----------



## Sammy

missplaced_idahoan said:


> go penn unless you are wading in 8' of water. don't waste your money on van stalls!


You mean shimano. Not penn. haha I kid


----------



## Dylan

Do not listen to most of this nonsense...buy a van Staal 250 and be done with it.. So when you hook a sailfish,tarpon or sharks your gears won't strip or your spool won't blow off..no bent rotor cups..DO NOT fish braid for any of the bigger species except ling


----------



## Sammy

Yes!! Wade fishing for a sail!!


----------



## countryfishingboy

listen to dylan he is a good fisherman and knows what he is talking bout


----------



## Sammy

If he knows what he's talking about he'd recommend a saltiga or Stella for the pier if someone wants to go high end.


----------



## Fishpc

Dylan said:


> Do not listen to most of this nonsense...buy a van Staal 250 and be done with it.. So when you hook a sailfish,tarpon or sharks your gears won't strip or your spool won't blow off..no bent rotor cups..DO NOT fish braid for any of the bigger species except ling


Please explain why not braided line?


----------



## Dylan

Braided line does not stretch so you will pull a lot of hooks..the shimanos or saltiga are bulkier and do not hold as much line..do you want a reel made out o some kind of plastic or aircraft aluminum and titanium..great for the boat also


----------



## Sammy

I had several van staals. I wanted to blend in with the pier rats but soon to find out how dumb it is to use a vs for pier. Now I had either sold them or given it to my employees for being the employee of the month. Once you put your hand on a Stella there's no going back. I have all of the reels mentioned in this thread and some that wasn't mentioned(accurate). Stella hands down and the saltiga comes a very close second. I would pick up my Stradic ci4 before I would pick up my vs. if I'm wade fishing I'm using my zeebaas. The stiffness on a vs turns me away and I even had vs to take the grease out of the gear and put oil in, it still sucked. And don't get me started on the drag.


----------



## Dylan

Just by the van Staal an save 400 dollars and get a better reel..


----------



## bay slayer

just get a staal well worth the money


----------



## kahala boy

Just want to say that it's not the reel that will catch the fish, It's the reel operator that catches the fish. I have caught 45 pound king on a 750 spooled with 17 lb mono and wire leader. Caught a stingray with same reel that broke the old 4 x 4 posts that had the scale on at Navarre pier(old). 

Doesn't the Van Staals say that you have to send them in for service annually or something like that?


----------



## jw2fish

Sammy said:


> I had several van staals. I wanted to blend in with the pier rats but soon to find out how dumb it is to use a vs for pier. Now I had either sold them or given it to my employees for being the employee of the month. Once you put your hand on a Stella there's no going back. I have all of the reels mentioned in this thread and some that wasn't mentioned(accurate). Stella hands down and the saltiga comes a very close second. I would pick up my Stradic ci4 before I would pick up my vs. if I'm wade fishing I'm using my zeebaas. The stiffness on a vs turns me away and I even had vs to take the grease out of the gear and put oil in, it still sucked. And don't get me started on the drag.


How long you plan to keep you Stella? What i known Shimano only keep their parts available for 5 years after new model come out which is 5 years from now you on your own if it need to repair. If you only can buy one reel i would go van staal or Zeebaas. Im prefer zeebaas over van staal because of their customer service. They are the best people to deal with. either one you cant go wrong. By the way I have own stella, zeebaas and van staal.


----------



## FreeDiver

Don't listen to any of these shimano morons. For kings only a 150-200 is more than enough. If you want a little more for other fish such as poons or ling 250 is perfect. See the difference in staals and these other guys is I'm willing to put my vs100 against there biggest Stella or there sweet 706 any day of the week.


----------



## FreeDiver

Go bail less by the way. Or your just a typical goog!


----------



## Sammy

Oh now you wanna start name calling? Typical van staal owners.


----------



## FreeDiver

It was a joke. To take offense to something like that, you my friend should rethink being on forums. Now what I was implying was Stella against a van staal. You didn't even think twice to challenge that theory of my little VS100 against any size Stella. Only thing you could bring up was I called the shimano boys morons? Dude, I own more than vanstaals.


----------



## hsiF deR

FreeDiver said:


> It was a joke. To take offense to something like that, you my friend should rethink being on forums. Now what I was implying was Stella against a van staal. You didn't even think twice to challenge that theory of my little VS100 against any size Stella. Only thing you could bring up was I called the shimano boys morons? Dude, I own more than vanstaals.


You should read up on some of the East Coast Blue Fin Tuna guys.......there is a reason that they all fish with Stellas.


----------



## Dylan

DO NOT use braid for kings!!!!!! Add sailfish to that also!!! DO NOT use braid off the pier for any of the bigger specie except ling.... DON'T DO IT


----------



## Randall2point0

Wirelessly posted



Dylan said:


> DO NOT use braid for kings!!!!!! Add sailfish to that also!!! DO NOT use braid off the pier for any of the bigger specie except ling.... DON'T DO IT


You don't like braid, to many wind knots or what?


----------



## Sammy

FreeDiver said:


> It was a joke. To take offense to something like that, you my friend should rethink being on forums. Now what I was implying was Stella against a van staal. You didn't even think twice to challenge that theory of my little VS100 against any size Stella. Only thing you could bring up was I called the shimano boys morons? Dude, I own more than vanstaals.


Dude. As many forum I'm in This forum is one of the nicer forum that Ive joined. I've learn not to get offended by what people on the Internet say or think. And most vs owner thinks their reel is the best out there and I have heard claims like yours from many vs owner so I didn't even bother to argue on that subject.


----------



## Dylan

No stretch so pull a lot of hooks..kings have softer mouths..also braid wears holes around your barbs of you hook..green braid is the same color As the water so youll get thrown over a bunch and it tangles real bad..plus you just don't need it


----------



## Sammy

Dylan said:


> DO NOT use braid for kings!!!!!! Add sailfish to that also!!! DO NOT use braid off the pier for any of the bigger specie except ling.... DON'T DO IT


All my fish has been caught on braid. On or off the pier. Just have some mono top shot for that little stretch for hook set. And watch your line and you'll be alright.


----------



## Sammy

Dylan said:


> No stretch so pull a lot of hooks..kings have softer mouths..also braid wears holes around your barbs of you hook..green braid is the same color As the water so youll get thrown over a bunch and it tangles real bad..plus you just don't need it


All of your points are valid. But my king rig consist of a Stradic ci4 4000 on a shimano terez 7'6 medium rod. Loaded up with Jerry brown 12 lb solid core braid and top shot with about 20 yards of momoi 16# mono. Like you said. The mono gives a better hook set and the stronger tops shot is to turn the fish if she decided to go crazy at the gaff and try to go under the pier. The main reason I use braid is for the capacity since I'm using a smaller reel. I use a light weight reel because I mainly use lures and casting all day that little 2 oz makes a difference.


----------



## FreeDiver

hsiF deR said:


> You should read up on some of the East Coast Blue Fin Tuna guys.......there is a reason that they all fish with Stellas.


You don't think a VS300 could handle that? Blue fins can be caught with a bungee para chord and two riffe 2ATM floats..... What's your point? I use my reels in the surf, pier, boat.offshore and inshore. I don't have to worry about my gears locking up or getting saltwater sickness. 

Dylan is right. It's a lot easier to use mono. You'll have plenty of stretch. He's not saying it can't be done. I tend to use power pro year round on mine. Just watch your fingers cause I've also have had a smoker put the line to the bone of my index. For The size fish your wanting to catch Vs200 or 250. That's more than enough. I use light tackle rod and my vs100 for kings. Power pro 20# for more yards and my casting is farther. The rod is a st. croix med. heavy action. Has enough juice to turn 6ft blackies around!


----------



## Sammy

Vs300 is a beast of a reel. But if i remember correctly the gear is too low, when a tuna is charging back at you, you couldn't crank the handle fast enough to keep the line tight. Which is really important when tuna fishing.


----------



## FreeDiver

That's why you have a captain move the boat forward. No reel on this planet could match the speed of a blue fin if it charged you.


----------



## FreeDiver

Ill put it to you this way blue fun tuna are epic for a spinning reel let alone tiagras or internationals. But the topic is not on blue fun tuna. It's on pier fishing. Have you ever tried closing a bail when a king eats your bait? Or do you leave to much slack out for everyone to try and throw over and reel around you?


----------



## hsiF deR

FreeDiver said:


> What's your point? .......!


The point is Shimano makes a better reel. I like VS's they have their place. But for most anglers, the advantage isnt there. If I was a big time VA stripe angler from the rocks and beach, well then advantage goes to the VS. For about 99% of other applications, advantage goes to the Stella.

But as far as kings go, VS and Stella is extreme overkill especially for the pier. I like my 706 because its old durable and cheap. 
Kings are not the toughest fighters in the gulf but as long as you have a drag and reasonable line capacity you can consistantly catch kings.

The skill is the hand that holds the reel not the reel in the hand.


----------



## Sammy

FreeDiver said:


> It's on pier fishing.


So tell me again why do you need a totally sealed reel again?


----------



## Sammy

FreeDiver said:


> That's why you have a captain move the boat forward. No reel on this planet could match the speed of a blue fin if it charged you.


so you think a boat moving forward from a complete standstill will match the speed of a tuna? The boat usually are just directional. The reels high speed retrieve plays a huge part of it. Ok. Back to pier fishing and why we don't need a totally sealed reel when you're 50 ft away from the water. To protect your reel when you spill your orange juice?


----------



## FreeDiver

From a stand still? Boat never stand still. And yes as your hooked up you captain should be pushing the boat as need in the direction needed. But anywho. Yes it's sealed. Can be worked on at the house. They don't make a 706 by the way. Not till the end of this year. Now my point was no bail.its a hell of a lot easier bail less for king off the pier. I get home July 10th. Being your Stella out of the closet I don't care how big she is. Well go for a fun fishin adventure. Boat pier yak surf. Ill bring my 100 and 250 and well see how they handle. Ill pay for the gas bill If that's an issue for you as well. I'm glad I re joined the forum. This makes my watch fly by. You know how hard it is to look at nothing but water and rigs all day?


----------



## FreeDiver

Although I might be having too much fun. Like I said. Pm me. Ill be home. Well go kill fish it's a win win. Adios batos!


----------



## Sammy

I like the sound of that. Haha. Let go kill fish.


----------



## Sammy

Haha. I owns Stella's. you think gas bill is gonna be a problem? Don't treat me like a van staal owners. Good job on trying to get a ride.


----------



## FreeDiver

I don't need your boat, stick. I told you to pick your poison. Although you'll be alone with the Stella on a pier. you sound more cocky than my deckhands..


----------



## FreeDiver

Would love to b/s with you some more but I have to make a run to the rigs. Enjoy.


----------



## Sammy

I really mean no harm man. But you're more stubborn than one of my hispanic busboy that works for me. At least his excuse is no speaking English. And FYI I do not fish the pier anymore. Too many people like you. Be careful out there.


----------



## jw2fish

Sammy said:


> Haha. I owns Stella's. you think gas bill is gonna be a problem? Don't treat me like a van staal owners. Good job on trying to get a ride.


Just wonder you bought your Stella brand new in the box or used?


----------

