# Unregistered handgun rebles.



## johnf (Jan 20, 2012)

Every time I hear about a shooting the local news anchor asks the officer on the case about whether or not the firearm was registered, and guess what? THEY NEVER ARE!!!!! I can't believe the number of people in AR that run around with unregistered firearms. Of course we don't register any firearms here in the Natural State except Class III. I don't have a single registered firearm in my house, I don't have one on my bedside table, and I don't ever have one in the console of my truck. My neighbor is a state trooper and has been on the news several times and has been asked that very question. I asked him about it and he said the State Police's unofficial rule is "If they are too stupid to realize we don't register guns, it's not our place to educate them".

Not only do we not register, it's state law that all records of sales be destroyed after a few years. Don't remember exactly how many. Do you guys register?

While we're at it, is there a limit on concealed carry? We can carry as many as we want. What about holsters, I know some states require them. Arkansas doesn't. Oh and can you print or does it have to be completely concealed?


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## JD7.62 (Feb 13, 2008)

johnf said:


> Every time I hear about a shooting the local news anchor asks the officer on the case about whether or not the firearm was registered, and guess what? THEY NEVER ARE!!!!! I can't believe the number of people in AR that run around with unregistered firearms. Of course we don't register any firearms here in the Natural State except Class III. I don't have a single registered firearm in my house, I don't have one on my bedside table, and I don't ever have one in the console of my truck. My neighbor is a state trooper and has been on the news several times and has been asked that very question. I asked him about it and he said the State Police's unofficial rule is "If they are too stupid to realize we don't register guns, it's not our place to educate them".
> 
> Not only do we not register,* it's state law that all records of sales be destroyed after a few years*. Don't remember exactly how many. Do you guys register?
> 
> While we're at it, is there a limit on concealed carry? We can carry as many as we want. What about holsters, I know some states require them. Arkansas doesn't. Oh and can you print or does it have to be completely concealed?


Well its federal law that the 4473 you fill out when you purchase from an FFL dealer is ALWAYS on record. If the FFL shuts down do you know where they go? Yep, straight to ATF to be filled away for eternity.


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## johnf (Jan 20, 2012)

JD7.62 said:


> Well its federal law that the 4473 you fill out when you purchase from an FFL dealer is ALWAYS on record. If the FFL shuts down do you know where they go? Yep, straight to ATF to be filled away for eternity.



The one we fill out here just says Handgun/long gun and has no place for brand/model or serial number. I've been told by several flls here that they are eventually destroyed. Also we only fll out one regardless of how many guns we are purchasing at the time. A person with a CCL only fills out the Name and address and then signs the bottom and the phone call isn't made.


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## Gravity3694 (May 10, 2011)

johnf said:


> The one we fill out here just says Handgun/long gun and has no place for brand/model or serial number. I've been told by several flls here that they are eventually destroyed. Also we only fll out one regardless of how many guns we are purchasing at the time. A person with a CCL only fills out the Name and address and then signs the bottom and the phone call isn't made.


What kind of FFL are you using? If they are a bonifide FFL dealer engaged in the business of selling firearms, then they must by federal law use a form 4473 for every sale. I've filled out over twenty 4473s in the past four years and every one that I've seen has on page 3 section D a complete description of the firearm that includes the serial number.

Form 4473 is a backdoor registration scheme. If you've never read about the ATF's Out of Business Records center, then it will make your blood boil. When a FFL goes out of business the ATF requires them to send their bound books to the ATF for archival purposes. The center currently receives 1.2 million records per month. The paper flow is staggering and to alleviate the situation and to make registration easier they are now digitizing the records.

The above reasons are why I like private sales, there is no direct registration to your name. The government has no business knowing what firearms you own.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...ckdoor-national-firearms-registration-scheme/


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## Splittine (Nov 24, 2007)

johnf said:


> The one we fill out here just says Handgun/long gun and has no place for brand/model or serial number. .


That's a big negative ghost rider. You have a spot for manufacturer, type gun, model, serial and caliber.


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## Splittine (Nov 24, 2007)

johnf said:


> Also we only fll out one regardless of how many guns we are purchasing at the time. A person with a CCL only fills out the Name and address and then signs the bottom and the phone call isn't made.


That's also false. You get called in regardless if you have a CWP or not. Who in the hell do you buy guns from, please post their name on here. Should be interesting.


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## johnsonbeachbum (Oct 1, 2007)

I will assume that each state can get the name of anyone that has ever legally purchased a firearm from a FFL dealer via the 4473 forms.
So in a way it is a "backdoor" gun registration as mentioned above.


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## johnf (Jan 20, 2012)

Splittine said:


> That's also false. You get called in regardless if you have a CWP or not. Who in the hell do you buy guns from, please post their name on here. Should be interesting.



Not in Arkansas you don't. None of them except for Wal-Mart because that's their policy.


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## JD7.62 (Feb 13, 2008)

Splittine said:


> That's also false. You get called in regardless if you have a CWP or not. Who in the hell do you buy guns from, please post their name on here. Should be interesting.


Now that part is true. Not all states require a call in. KY didnt either with CCW which is good for me cause I get delayed EVERYTIME. I think the states have to meet a requirement to do that. For example, in KY, the state does a monthly NICS check on every CCW holder so I guess because they keep on top of that the feds allow the CCW to count as a call in.


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## johnf (Jan 20, 2012)

Splittine said:


> That's also false. You get called in regardless if you have a CWP or not. Who in the hell do you buy guns from, please post their name on here. Should be interesting.


BTW, we were always told it was a federal law that you couldn't carry a gun in a school or a bank. Also UNTRUE. Those are up to the state.


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## Splittine (Nov 24, 2007)

I'm sorry I figured we were talking about FL since this is the PFF.


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## Gravity3694 (May 10, 2011)

JD7.62 said:


> Now that part is true. Not all states require a call in. KY didnt either with CCW which is good for me cause I get delayed EVERYTIME. I think the states have to meet a requirement to do that. For example, in KY, the state does a monthly NICS check on every CCW holder so I guess because they keep on top of that the feds allow the CCW to count as a call in.


The Brady act allows states to exempt residents who have permits from having to go through NICS or an equivalent. FL used to allow it, but the ATF got upset and claimed that the Florida Department of Agriculture is not a law enforcement agency and is therefore not allowed to do background checks which is a requirement in the Brady act.


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## johnf (Jan 20, 2012)

Splittine said:


> I'm sorry I figured we were talking about FL since this is the PFF.



It's all good. I thought I made it clear I was from Arkansas. Guess not. No harm. :thumbsup:


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## omrbh (Aug 22, 2011)

Gravity3694 said:


> The Brady act allows states to exempt residents who have permits from having to go through NICS or an equivalent. FL used to allow it, but the ATF got upset and claimed that the Florida Department of Agriculture is not a law enforcement agency and is therefore not allowed to do background checks which is a requirement in the Brady act.


So what agency does the checks for Fl residents? Local Sheriff's Dept, FDLE, FBI, NICS or all the above? Are the checks just overseen by the Ag Dept?


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## johnf (Jan 20, 2012)

In Arkansas they go to our State Police in Little Rock. Maybe that's why we don't have to do the call, we also do a fingerprint card and our application must be reviewed by our county sheriff. The sheriff can block the license, but must have justification.


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## Gravity3694 (May 10, 2011)

omrbh said:


> So what agency does the checks for Fl residents? Local Sheriff's Dept, FDLE, FBI, NICS or all the above? Are the checks just overseen by the Ag Dept?


FDLE. SB234 was passed last year and it allows the Department of Agriculture to take fingerprints. I don't know exactly what that will mean though.


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## jhamilton226 (Oct 1, 2010)

I agree with gravity's first post...private sales only in my safe except for the shotgun...but that's my home defense weapon, so if ever used for its intended purpose I don't want any questions as to were it came from...otherwise, the government doesn't need to know what guns I own or that I even have more than one...just makes it easier for them to try to and take em away someday...of course the jig is up now I guess! lol


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## JoeKing (Apr 1, 2011)

Don't worry, everyone in government took an oath to never infringe on our rights to keep and bear arms.


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## omrbh (Aug 22, 2011)

JoeKing said:


> Don't worry, everyone in government took an oath to never infringe on our rights to keep and bear arms.


:yes::whistling:


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