# Raymarine E120 Classic and Transducer Issues



## bcahn

Equipment:
07 Pursuit Denali 265 LS 
Deadrise 21 deg
Raymarine E120 Classic
SeaTalk
DSM 300
Airmar B60 Transducer
Raymarine Radar HD 

Problem: First time in deep water (250ft) and my machine lost bottom. Tried resetting the system, updating the software and manually controlling the Hz, nothing work. Talked to Raymarine, they offer to bench check the DSM which they did for no charge, all was well. 
Decided to install another Transducer, this time I went with a in-hull, Airmar M260 model big monster!:notworthy:
Install went perfect, thanks Jan, took her out for a spin and now I'm losing bottom at cruise speeds and up. Had to install the tranducer on the dead rise just pass centerline about a foot to port because the B60 ducer took the center spot and structurally I had no other options. Did everything as the manual suggested, even did the water bag trick and everything appear to be working. Call Raymarine again, they recommended a factor reset on my system, which I did. During the reset, I got the "Blue Screen of Death", not good . Call them back, I was adviced to continue with the reset and see what happens. The new software version took and it appears to be working. 
Keep in mine, I'm not an expert but I am experienced in mechanical and electronics issues. I haven't been out since the reset and I'm hoping this issue is resolved. I was just wondering if anyone else has had issues similar to this one. Great boat, great electronics, but it bothers the hell out of me losing bottom while fishing.


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## Kevdog540

Yes I have the same problem at times as well, also random "No Data Source" on the depth. I have the E-80 with the same transducer mounted like yours. I to sent my DSM in a few years ago and was sent back a new one. I will be resetting it and adding the newest software update this evening. Hopefully this with fix my issues as well. With that said I've always lost bottom running in over 200ft.


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## bcahn

Kevdog,
Thanks for your quick response. Do you have my old B60 transducer or my new M260? The new software for the DSM is V4.2 and the E120 is V5.69. Hope that helps, man I tell you, Raymarine can be very difficult to deal with. The DSM 300 had a recall, of course it expired right when i found out. They didn't replace but did bench check, not to say when this is installed with other components its not performing as advertise. My new ducer is losing bottom at cruise, worked great while drifting over fish. Didn't get out to deep water with it yet.
Hope your new updates help! 
Tight lines to you bro


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## Fletch Lives

I had a classic c120 w DSM 300 and all I had was problems. Raymarine sent me a new DSM 300 still lost data. Replaced fuse blocks and rewired a few things to prevent voltage changes and it still was unreliable. I ended up buying a newer unit raymarine a67 that didn't use the DSM. I plugged existing transducer into new unit and no problems since. The DSM 300 is simply a bad product. Basically any voltage changes causes it to go out even a brand new "properly functioning" unit. All that being said the service etc from raymarine was pretty good and that's why I stuck with them. I kept the c120 for radar and GPS and use a67 for fish finder and backup GPS. Goodluck.


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## bcahn

Fletch Lives said:


> I had a classic c120 w DSM 300 and all I had was problems. Raymarine sent me a new DSM 300 still lost data. Replaced fuse blocks and rewired a few things to prevent voltage changes and it still was unreliable. I ended up buying a newer unit raymarine a67 that didn't use the DSM. I plugged existing transducer into new unit and no problems since. The DSM 300 is simply a bad product. Basically any voltage changes causes it to go out even a brand new "properly functioning" unit. All that being said the service etc from raymarine was pretty good and that's why I stuck with them. I kept the c120 for radar and GPS and use a67 for fish finder and backup GPS. Goodluck.


Thanks Fletch, I was on other sites and I'm hearing the same thing, the DSM 300 is a piece of crap!


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## PaulBoydenCustoms

My last trip out I lost bottom in about 800' couldnt figure out why I have a pair of E120's and 1kw transducer. and I still have "dsm connection lost" problems while trimming motors or adjusting trim tabs 
sometimes


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## bcahn

PaulBoydenCustoms said:


> My last trip out I lost bottom in about 800' couldnt figure out why I have a pair of E120's and 1kw transducer. and I still have "dsm connection lost" problems while trimming motors or adjusting trim tabs
> sometimes


I'm hoping enough folks will comment to this thread and I plan to send it to Raymarine. So far everything is pointing to the DSM.
Thanks Paul


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## Fletch Lives

Paul I had the same issues. I went as far to disconnect the house battery from the other batteries and had the house on a stand alone switch but then of course the house battery doesn't recharge from the engine alternators and it would still lose data connection. It always seemed to happen to me in the middle of a tourney or 60 miles offshore, always when I needed it most.


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## Fletch Lives

Bchan raymarine knows all about this. That's why they recalled it years back. Also why all of their newer models don't use DSM 300 anymore. If they checked out your DSM and its fine then I'd sell it and get a unit that doesn't have one. Some people use them just fine and you can still sell em online for about $300.


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## Kevdog540

bchan. my ducer is at least 7 years old I have looked for a model number but cant find it. Thanks for the info on the updates, I had to order a super small CF card(that should be here today) so my dinosaur of a machine can read it. We are heading SE for a little DD action sat/sun so I hope this resolves some of my issues.


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## bcahn

Kevdog540 said:


> bchan. my ducer is at least 7 years old I have looked for a model number but cant find it. Thanks for the info on the updates, I had to order a super small CF card(that should be here today) so my dinosaur of a machine can read it. We are heading SE for a little DD action sat/sun so I hope this resolves some of my issues.


NO worries, just was checking, I'm guessing on my old one as well. I got the boat used, have all the papers and manual except the ducer. Compared pics and it's very close to the Airmar B60. Sucks cause that M260 is not cheap!


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## bcahn

Fletch Lives said:


> Bchan raymarine knows all about this. That's why they recalled it years back. Also why all of their newer models don't use DSM 300 anymore. If they checked out your DSM and its fine then I'd sell it and get a unit that doesn't have one. Some people use them just fine and you can still sell em online for about $300.


Roger that, now you're telling me to get authorization for another 2K from the boss, yes folks, you won't be seeing the "Miss Ruth" on the water anytime soon!  lmao

The good news is the old ducer is still installed and it works great until I hit deep water and I'm not out far often. Even though I made my first rig/tuna run in March and man I'm hooked!!!!!:yes:


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## PaulBoydenCustoms

Ive loved my raymarine, but they sure do make it difficult to add on anything, seems like theres always a dozen parts you need to do anything, and they are all expensive


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## X-Shark

And Now you know Why I hate Raymarine.

Cheap connector's, menu based machines that force jumping thru hoops to name a few.

Obviously there is a better markup on Raymarine, because if you go to Georges without knowledge....Raymarine is what they will push your toward.

Ever see Raymarine on a commercial boat? I haven't....whats that tell you?


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## Ocean Master

I have the E120 and E80 with the DSM300 and 1kw transducer. I do lose bottom at cruising speed but I switch the unit from fishing to cruising and it works (sometimes). I did alternately loose bottom at the spur over 2000'. Other than that they have been great and I haven't thought of changing anything.

Their are times the unit does go whacko at normal depths but comes back in less than a minute.

Installed in 2009.


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## bcahn

Ocean Master said:


> I have the E120 and E80 with the DSM300 and 1kw transducer. I do lose bottom at cruising speed but I switch the unit from fishing to cruising and it works (sometimes). I did alternately loose bottom at the spur over 2000'. Other than that they have been great and I haven't thought of changing anything.
> 
> Their are times the unit does go whacko at normal depths but comes back in less than a minute.
> 
> Installed in 2009.


Thanks for that info Sir, yesterday I saw an improvement. After updating the software to V5.69, at cruise and high speeds the unit performed better. Once I got in chop I lost bottom periodically. I did try a few things with good results. 

I notice when cruising back to port, my screen split in fours, the bottom stayed with me, even in the rough stuff. I lost bottom but it recovered quickly. Radar, GPS, Route Guidance and Sonar operating. So maybe this issue relates to video refresh rates. Just thinking out loud!


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## Reelbait

I too have the Raymarine C120 with the 300DSM. Original 300 was made in Mexico. Replaced with new one made in Eastern Europe?. Problem seems to be solved.


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## bcahn

Well, just talked Raymarine Tech, very nice gentlemen who is willing to swap my DSM 300 for troubleshooting purposes. He thinks it's a cavitation issue, not sure if I agree with that, this is a in-hull and I had no issues when I went to reverse. I'll take that route and see what happens and post the latest.


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## Kim

Remember Ben the higher on the hull you go the more air bubble interference you will have. If RM swaps out the unit for the new version (Made in Croatia I think) , that should rule out the DSM module.


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## bcahn

Kim said:


> Remember Ben the higher on the hull you go the more air bubble interference you will have. If RM swaps out the unit for the new version (Made in Croatia I think) , that should rule out the DSM module.


Roger that, hopefully the DSM fixes the issue.


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## bcahn

Well I got out yesterday to test more troubleshooting options. As previously mentioned, the new transducer perform the same. Lost bottom on plane. Ray tech advised to check to see if engine noise or electrical interference was an issue or not enough fluid in the tank. 
I check the tank, it was full and at the dock I rev the rpm's to a safe speed, no interference. Like I said before, this transducer works flawlessly over spots drift fishing! 
Ray tech did offer to swap DSM's for free. That's my next move, if this doesn't help I may run a separate unit just to eliminate the DSM all together.


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## k-p

I have a C-80 and went through all the issues everybody has described in this thread. Just ask X-shark, he knows it very well and at least got me up and running after I had everybody and their brother not able to fix it. Still can't stand Raymarine as I've used them before on other boats and they are incredibly unintuitive. Had my machine go out before and paid the $700 repair fee only to have the DSM go out a year later and have to pay another $400 for it. Oh, and they love putting stupid alarms (like position lost) on these things that you can't turn off. All I need is something beeping at me at 5am when I'm trying to get the boat ready. What a way to start the day. Will never own another Raymarine again.


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## Lyin Too

I have an Airmar B-164 on my C-120 and it works great up to 400' deep then wont read nothing. How do you troubleshoot these to get them working right?


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## bcahn

Lyin Too said:


> I have an Airmar B-164 on my C-120 and it works great up to 400' deep then wont read nothing. How do you troubleshoot these to get them working right?


Do you have the DSM 300, if so, make sure you have the new software version. Also make sure its set to the correct ducer and kw.


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## bcahn

Well,
Got a new DSM still in the box yesterday, plan to install and take a test run tomorrow. Keeping all fingers crossed!


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## bcahn

Well, got a chance to use the New DSM, same issue, lose bottom at cruise and very sporadic. trolling and bottom dropping on a drift, no problem. That Airmar M260 ducer is the boom! 
I'm done, just will have to live with it!


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## Lyin Too

How do I update the software?


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## bcahn

Lyin Too said:


> How do I update the software?


Download the new software to a blank CF card, go to data and follow the directions from there.


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## bcahn

Updating this thread.
After consulting several experts, I went with Kim's advice and moved the M260 ducers closer to centerline, what do you know, it works perfect now! My pursuit haul with its curved bottom produces a lot of bubbles as you move up the dead rise causes more interference. Got the ducer out of the trails, bam! 
Thanks PFF and particularly Kim for great advice.


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## tbaxl

Good to hear, and way to go Kim.


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## dabood

*Losing bottom issue also*

I have had nothing but problems with mine also. Had it checked and they said it was good. Keeps losing bottom, its off as much as it is on. Changed ethernet cable nothing changed. I don't know what else to do.
What junk.... If It wasen't for my auto pilot I throw it over board.
Any body ever get there's working?????

David.


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## dabood

*My componets (flashing depth)*

MFD E90 / DSM300 / M260 1KW / auto pilot
Can't keep it from flashing, I read over 2000 ft when working but so inconsistent its driving me crazy.


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## X-Shark

Check the Box.....Mine developed a small leak. It went thru a flashing stage one day and then nothing. You fill it with Non Tox antifreeze....It's Pink.


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## dabood

I just ordered the CP300 to replace the DSM 300. Anybody had issues with that box?


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## Getsome

I sent my DSM 300 back to Raymarine because of problems. I had the made in Mexico unit. They sent me a brand new one at no cost.


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## dabood

I sent it back about 6 month ago, they tested and sent back. I'm sooooooo sick of this issue I spent $700 on CP300. I sure hope it works. Ready to deep 6 all my Raymarine. If it wasn't for my auto pilot I'd trash this crap.


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## Getsome

dabood said:


> I sent it back about 6 month ago, they tested and sent back. I'm sooooooo sick of this issue I spent $700 on CP300. I sure hope it works. Ready to deep 6 all my Raymarine. If it wasn't for my auto pilot I'd trash this crap.


Is it made in Mexico? They have been replacing them with new ones. The test results came back as a hardware failure on my. When I called tech support they told me if it was made in Mexico that they would replace it and they did. 

I was loosing the bottom every 3 minutes for a brief period and loosing the fixed position on my GPS. X-Shark found it to have 8 blinking lights error code. Have you checked the error code out on their website?


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## dabood

Don't think it is a Mexico box, thats why they didn't replace it. Heard about them boxes.
The error lights are on the DSM correct? I'm going to update DSM & MFD software in couple days. I ordered a CP300 other day I was so mad, still gonna try and get DSM working this week and return CP300. 
Anyone had problems with the CP300? I would think bugs would be worked out of it.


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## X-Shark

> The error lights are on the DSM correct?


Yes......


Status LED
The LED on the connector panel provides valuable information on the status of
your sounder module. The LED blinks green while the module is operating
normally. If the unit detects a problem, the LED blinks amber to indicate a warning
or red for an error. The number of times the LED blinks is a code representing the
nature of the problem. For multiple warnings/errors, the codes are given in
sequence with a 1.5 second pause between strings.
The following table shows the various LED status codes and their meanings.
1After 30 seconds of no network activity, the sounder enters Standby mode: No sonar pings
are emitted and no warnings are output on the LED. Instead, the LED blinks green once
every 10 seconds.
For example, if the Transducer Sense fails and the network is not detected, the LED blinks
amber once, pauses 1.5 secs, blinks amber twice 0.5 secs apart, pauses 1.5 secs, and then
repeats the sequence until the problems are resolved or up to 10 minutes elapse.
Sounder temperature
readings are wrong
1. If necessary, adjust the TEMP CALIBRATE parameter.
2. If receiving SeaTalk temperature, unplug the SeaTalk connector
from the display.
Sonar display is unreliable
at high boat speeds
1. Turbulence around the transducer may be confusing the
unit.
Table 2-2: Status LED Warning Indications
Color
No of
blinks Meaning
Cleared
every 10 min
W Amber 1 Transducer Sense Failure
A 2 Network not detected 1
R 3 High Temperature Warning ✓
N 4 Reserved
I 5 Reserved
N 6 Reserved
G 7 Reserved
S 8 Watchdog Timeout Reboot




Table 2-3: Status LED Error Indications
Color
No of
blinks Meaning
Cleared
every 10 min
Red 1 Unknown Error ✓
E 2 Battery Voltage Error ✓
R 3 High Temperature Error ✓
R 4 Flash Memory Failure
O 5 Reserved
R 6 Reserved
S 7 Reserved
8 Hardware Moniter failure


A solid red LED (not blinking) indicates a fatal error condition. If the event of a fatal error,
the system will power cycle to attempt to self-correct the condition. If the condition
persists, please contact Raymarine Customer Service


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## dabood

*DSM Flashing*

Thanks for all the info and spending that much time. I been gone so just getting back into this issue. 

Note: I was so mad last time out I bought a CP300 but haven't taken it out of box. I don't need to hook it up if they have issues also. Trying to keep it new for return.

Here is where I'm at, I updated my DSM, haven't been able to update E9W because Scan Card I bought was (2 GB) Raymarine said card to big so I bought a 128 MB, that card won't hold the files, (says card to small)...
I wish soooo bad I bought Garmin or any other but I'm stuck. Auto Pilot works great.... only thing I like.
I changed the battery that runs my electronics (that seems to have helped).
I got a message on the screen 3 times that read (ping inactive) when I restarted the DSM it came back on and worked. I still get flashing when moving at "any" higher speeds or when its ruff, that seems to me that its losing bottom and not the DSM? I have a 31' Fountain and had the trans. cut into the bottom, they put it in the center of hull about 5 ft from strern. Seems like a good spot but maybe not. 1000 watt trans. about $1000.00.

I was out by myself yesterday and it was very ruff, I couldn't go down and check error code that you mention, I will do that tomorrow I hope. Any advice on the CP300? Should I try it or you think it will have same problem?

Thanks, David.


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## bcahn

*Moving the Ducer*



dabood said:


> Thanks for all the info and spending that much time. I been gone so just getting back into this issue.
> 
> Note: I was so mad last time out I bought a CP300 but haven't taken it out of box. I don't need to hook it up if they have issues also. Trying to keep it new for return.
> 
> Here is where I'm at, I updated my DSM, haven't been able to update E9W because Scan Card I bought was (2 GB) Raymarine said card to big so I bought a 128 MB, that card won't hold the files, (says card to small)...
> I wish soooo bad I bought Garmin or any other but I'm stuck. Auto Pilot works great.... only thing I like.
> I changed the battery that runs my electronics (that seems to have helped).
> I got a message on the screen 3 times that read (ping inactive) when I restarted the DSM it came back on and worked. I still get flashing when moving at "any" higher speeds or when its ruff, that seems to me that its losing bottom and not the DSM? I have a 31' Fountain and had the trans. cut into the bottom, they put it in the center of hull about 5 ft from strern. Seems like a good spot but maybe not. 1000 watt trans. about $1000.00.
> 
> I was out by myself yesterday and it was very ruff, I couldn't go down and check error code that you mention, I will do that tomorrow I hope. Any advice on the CP300? Should I try it or you think it will have same problem?
> 
> Thanks, David.


Dave,
Just saw your post today. I started this thread with a different issue than yours. My system was working correctly, it was my ducer to high on the deadrise. After moving it closer to centerline, everything is working great now!
One thing I would try is the ducer in a bag of water temp install. Take the ducer out of the tank, place in a plastic bag and reposition to other areas. You have something in the fiberglass interfering with the ducer. Also check for nicks or kinks in the ducer cable. 
What else is hook to the DSM? Is everything else working? I have seatalk installed to interface with my radar and VHF signals.
Don't give up just yet, once everything is working right, Raymarine is a great product. 
Give me a call if you want to talk more in detail.
Ben
@428-0378


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## dabood

*flashing code lights*

While looking at DSM I seen 
Flashing green flash, flash, flash, than it went (4 quick yellow) than a short pause than (4 short yellow) short pause (4 short yellow) than back to green flashing.
Mean anything????


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## dabood

*cut into hull*

My ducer is cut into Hull. Can't move it.


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## bcahn

In the DSM manual under troubleshooting, I think it tells you what the light sequence means.


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