# Riffe or Ocean Rhino???



## marmidor

I am just getting into spearfishing and i am not sure what gun to by. It seems that most people shoot Riffe but i also like the rhino. What do you guys think?? I understand you get what you pay for so im down with making an investmant. Thanks guys!


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## TONER

I vote Rhino the Riffe takes to long to reload


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## Mr. Bostin

ive had four guns i bought a rife and i will never buy another gun, i does take a little longer to relode but in my opinion i would go with rife


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## Evensplit

Riffeshootsfaster, quieter, and more accurate at longer range.

Rhino generally reloads quicker and is a bruiser of a gun.

I prefer the Riffefor the longer range and accuracy,especially with the lower bag limits. If I was shooting for quantity I'd go with a Rhino - or an AB Biller retrofitted with a rhino speed load system.

The "Rhino" guns of today are not what they were 2 years ago when they were using sea hornet parts. There is a big difference between the old and new, anda lot of folks on here are familiar with the old style.The new style is about double the price of the old.


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## Desperado

I have the ability to shoot both . The rhino DEFINATLEY reloads a lot faster. While the Riffe is definatley quieter. As far as accuracy, I would give a slight nod to the Riffe, but not by much. I shoot a Rhino #2 and a Riffe #3, so of course the Riffe has more range and power (it is a bigger gun, plus has 3 bands vs. 2). I have added a 3rd band to the Rhino but have yet to use it configured that way. 

I tend to grab the Rhino more, because of the reloading speed. If I am going on a "one-shot-large-fish" (AJ hunting)dive I go Riffe. Everything else I grab the Rhino, it is just so much more user friendly.

Tough choice......but you will be happy and bring home lots of fish with either gun.


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## TONER

No offense but Mr Bostin just got certified last weekend and I never knew you spearfished Jimoke

trust me go for ease / speed of loading


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## Clay-Doh

Both are great guns, and I have not shot the new rhino, but I have checked em out and they look pretty bad ass.



Depends on what kinda spearing your going to do.



If your the type to go down and shoot every legal fish you can, gray snappers, etc...rhino may be a better choice. I personally only pull the trigger on larger fish, and go many dives without shooting anything. I know you been freediving, and when I do that, I shoot everything legal too, because you have all day. But you only have so much air and time on scuba, and you may change your habbits. And for that, longer shots on bigger fish, I liked my Riffe.


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## marmidor

Thanks for all the good info guys. Is there a gun that would make a good all around gun? Something i could shoot quality or quanity with? I do understand that each gun is different and you give up something from gun to gun. thanks again guys.


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## Desperado

Truthfully, a Riffe or Rhino will do both. They are both what I would consider top notch guns as far as build qualityand customer support. I would just pick out with one I liked bestand buy it, you will not regret either of them.


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## Clay-Doh

I would try others peoples guns, because everyone is different in what they like. Since you are willing to spend the money to get exactly what you want the first time around,definately try a few.



But you are doing it right by getting the gun you will be happy for forever instead of the first cheapest thing you can find, and then ending up trying to sell it to get what you really want.



Either gun will work for you. Some peole like Chad (TONER) don't like reloading the riffe. It has a learning curve. After you get familiar with it though, it takes about 5 to 10 seconds more than a gun with a muzzle, so it depends how important that time is to you.



Also, are you a big guy that is going to power your gun up with thicker and/or shorter bands. If so, a solid stock gun like the riffe, or the new rhino. The old rhinos were just hopped up sea hornets/ billers, which had the same "stress" point as all Billers and JBL's. Where the wood stock is screwed into the handle flexes a little as your pulling back thick short bands.



I would go up there to MBT and talk to Jim (Evensplit) or any one up there and compare there different guns they have if you havent already.



They have riffe, billers, I think they still have a new Ocean Rhino, and they have a new solid stock JBL. Will give you a good idea of em.



I do gotta say though that new Ocean Rhino looks to be the shizz... and on spearboard there is nothing but good reviews for it.



Now you just gotta figure out what size to get!


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## Evensplit

> *TONER (2/5/2010)*... I never knew you spearfished Jimoke...


Maybe because you spend too much time on Craig's list? oke


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## wm4480

When I got assigned to the NAS here in September, I bought a 48" Ocean Rhino and just started shooting fish with it. I am no expert like Clay or Jim, but everything everyone has said about accuracy, reload speed, and durability is on target. Just recently after the spearfishing seminar, I spent the money on the kill package, a new shaft with a tri-cut tip, and a third band; I cannot wait to get in the water and kill something with it for 2010. I believe it to be a great all around gun at that length and I've shot everything from trigger to AJ's with it. Mine has the actual rhino lining coating on it like you'd find in the back of someone's pickup truck, and it will straight up take a beating and still look and work great. (Actually, all the guns I own are ugly but will still work after u beat the crap out of 'em.) 



The downfall of the Rhino is the noise when shot as the shaft exits the muzzle. It is loud and you can hear it from across a wreck (like the Avocet), but sometimes that noise makes more fish curious and can be a good thing. 



Good job on doing your homework, and whatever you choose you will not be disappointed. Right now over at MBT they have a beautiful 48" Riffe and I think they still have a 48" teak Ocean Rhino, I'd encourage you to go over and check 'em both out. They've also got all the parts and good stuff to go with it. Hope this helps.



PS. Clay, I let Dalton borrow my gun the other day, if you wanna shoot a Rhino sometime call me and I'll let you dive with it.



-Wilson

Fly NAVY, Dive Pensacola, Go VOLS!!

:usaflag


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## TONER

TONER (2/5/2010)... I never knew you spearfished Jim [Poke] ...



Maybe because you spend too much time on Craig's list? [Poke] 



You must have been talking to my wife she says that all the time :doh


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## Clay-Doh

Haa haa...you called me an expert. I just happen to get video footage of the couple fish I shoot..but I can't wait now for the comments to roll in about me and the word expert used in the same sentence!



I would love to try that New style Ocean Rhino. I was wondering about it's buoyancy underwater since it is such a beefy gun. But good move on a kill spike. You will find that thing is like a microwave or cell phone. Something you did fine without, but once3 you use it...man o man... you'll wonder how you could get along without it!



Hard using the gun to get a perfectly targeted stab on the fish to actually put it to sleep, but absolutely awesome for pinning the fish against the wreck or sand to get on top of it and work him over and put your stringer thru him without worrying about bending your shaft. 



I just got my new spear gun in the mail Wednesday after selling my Riffe. Got a custom made "DeathStick" with a fully enclosed poured epoxy track. It is bad ass.....and the handle and grip is sweeeeet. he trigger is hairpin! Cant wait to waste some fish!


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## marmidor

Thanks for all of the info. and advice. I headed to MBT at lunch and talked with those guys and like always they were more than willing to help me in anyway. I have decided to go with the Riffe.....i just like everything about it. As far as the reloading i can see that it will take a little gett

ing use to but should not take that long to figure out. It was nice to put a face with name Split (Jim). Thanks again to everyone of the advice!! Stay safe and get ready boys its coming!!!!


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## seanmclemore

what it boils down to, other than claydoh's expert opinion (had to do it), is comfort. if you can handle taskloading then the riffe is AMAZING. during the tournaments i carry both, USUALLY ON THE SAME DIVE. rich (spearfisher) and i started carrying two guns at a time 2-3 years ago in the G&H tourney and it has paid off on multiple occasions. i beleive they both pack an equal punch and have comparable range/accuracy. you are only going to shoot the length of the cord on the gun. last year in the alabama open i killed a 23lb snapper and as soon as i shot him the 30lb grouper swam out and instead of draggin up my riffe, i had enough time to reload the rhino and shoot the grouper as well...its fast, and hits hard.

other hand, i have killed multiple AJ over 60lbs with the riffe, killed my biggest snapper at 30.8lb with it, buddy mikeyb killed a cobia over (or right at) 50lb with the riffe...shot placement is key with any gun...its all in preference. if you are comfortable with it you can kill any fish you would ever want to shoot.

you are definatly in a stalemate with two of the best in my opinion. if i were only going to buy 1 gun i think it would be the rhino right now....BUT WHO ONLY WANTS ONE GUN!!!!!

good luck bro. hope to get to shoot something soon, otherwise i'm going to get some catfish and throw in the pool so i can get some practice.

cheers


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## Clay-Doh

Bit of advice.



When your at home one evening watching TV...get drunk as hell...while your sitting on the couch pull out your new Riffe and unload and re-string it. Get reall good at it even when drunk, and as long as you usually dive somewhat sober...it will be a breeze!



Word of warning though...



Don't:



Load the bands while drunk.



Load the bands then chase the cats around the house with the loaded speargun.



Fire it in the yard to see "just how damn far will this thing shoot out of water?"



If after doing the #3 don't, you realize it is really good idea to fire into something to avoid the mayhem that follows, do not fire into a large hardwood tree in your back yard. Unless you have an extra tip and don't mind breaking off the one lodged in the tree to get your shaft back.



I have no experience in any of the above...just saying....


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## Telum Pisces

Hell, I shoot a 20 year old JBL Woody Magnum that will kill the fish. Who needs all this fancy new stuff. Sure the trigger mechanism bends and feels like it could snap at anytime. But it has not let me down yet. It's powerfull, and has plenty of reach. It'a a pawn shop specialty gun. 

My advice is if you are new to the sport is to either try one out before you buy. Or get something cheaper than a Riffe. Honestly, the riffe is a great gun. But someone new the sport needs something a little easier to reload underwater. 

And somehow, my 20 year old JBL seems to kill more and bigger fish than what Clay's Riffe kills.:moon:moon:letsdrink

Just poking at ya Clay


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## marmidor

Dang man just when i thought i had it figured out and knew what i wanted i get more great feedback and advice. I am now thinking that i might just buy a decant gun to use for the summer until i can tryout both the Riffe and the Rhino!


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## Telum Pisces

> *marmidor (2/5/2010)*Dang man just when i thought i had it figured out and knew what i wanted i get more great feedback and advice. I am now thinking that i might just buy a decant gun to use for the summer until i can tryout both the Riffe and the Rhino!


The thing about the riffe is that you either love it or hate it. I personally do not like it. I want something that is easy to load underwater. Yes, you can practice and you do get better at reloading it. And eventually, you can get to where you can do it in your sleep. But most that arenew to spearfishing need things to be as simple as possible underwater right from the get go. I just suggest something like a 48" Biller wood gun. Easy on the pocket book, goodquality gun, and easy to reload.I personally like theway my JBLreloads the shock cordon the side of the gun. But everyone has their preferences. That is why it may not be a good idea to spend big bucks on something that you have not tried out yet. 

JBL has come out with a new one piece version of their guns that are much better than the old version in my opinion. When my old JBL finally kicks the bucket, that's what I'll be getting.


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## Clay-Doh

If you want a one piece stock... but wanna save $150 or so, the BIller LTD's are one piece. What I don't like about them is they are very thin wood. More wood = more mass wich means less recoil, but also the extra mass is positively bouyant wood mass...which means more underwater flotation, which allows you to swim with your gun stretched straight out with one hand underwater, without straining your forearm muscles.



The other thing I don't like about it is it's a one piece stock, instaed of a laminated stock made up of different pieces of wood with grain patterns in different directions. Basically, that means chance the gun could warp.



As far as JBL woodys...my first gun was a JBL woody magnum from a pawn shop, old and beat up...and that thing shot tru and was an awsome gun. Only reason I went to a Rife was because like I said, 3 5/8" bands 2" shorter than stock put a lot of strain on the handle junction, and I knew one day it would eventually snap.



I would however say this...stay away from a NEW JBL woody. There quality control has went strait to crap, they are using inferior parts, and I had a brand new one crack the very first day out, and after 2 months when they finally replaced it, had problems with that one and had to get new parts. Also, saw at least 5 of there new shafts, brand new that where not machined properly and the slide ring would jam on to the base of it, one so bad even vice grips wouldn't remove it. Also, brand new one in a shop fired all by itself with out anyone even having there finger on the trigger. It's a shame, cuz the old ones are a work horse. If you go that route, but a used one at least 5 years old.



However, you will like the Riffe. (Or OCean Rhino for that matter). MOst people who say they do not like em have not owned one. It will take about 3 days of diving with it to get good at re-stringing it. Then it will be absolutely no problem. But be prepared first few times to be a lil frustrated.



I would find what you want and get it though...personally. If you buy something, you wll probably take a loss when you sell it. So get what you want the first time! As long as you know its what you want.


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## Telum Pisces

Clay,

Have you had a chance to hold a new one piece JBL yet. I was at the shop the other day when a rep brought one in and I was impressed. Thicker piece of wood compared to a Biller. You can order it with either a closed or open muzzle. So you can string it like a riffe if you want to have the open muzzle. It felt like a very solid gun. Nothing like their newer two piece guns.


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## Clay-Doh

Yeah I checked it out...fat thick wood stock...feels nice and looks nice. I am just very wary of JBL's new guns now after seein 3 of there brand new guns fail, and 5 shafts that I can count. I don't know if there havin pieces manufactured and shiped in from china or what...but I don't think they are worth a crap. And the ones that failed looked good and felt good, and of course the wood was pretty...but mechanically, they were downright dangerous.



If just I have seen 8 of there componets fail in a one year period, I can imagine. Maybe in the last 2 years it's changed, I don't know. But I was disapointed. Flyinfhsr, DKdiver, Rocklobster, Fenderbender, UnderwaterAngler, Carlos from BayBreeze, have all seen it.


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## Pierce07

> *Clay-Doh (2/5/2010)*Yeah I checked it out...fat thick wood stock...feels nice and looks nice.


That's what she said!!!!!!! :moon


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## Clay-Doh

Paul...you are a douche bag. But a funny one...Renee' is sitting here reading that laughing her ass off.


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## BOHUNTER1

Thanks Paul... Now we have to read all these Detroit analogies... Great


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## countryjwh

i have shot a biller sea hornet with the whino liner stuff on it so far for 7 years and have killed up to 40 lb jacks with no problem. i have yet to have the oppurtunity to shoot anything bigger except one cobia and well, operater error, i missed. i love that gun and everyhting on it is origonal except the cord and the slide rings. the slide rings are about the only thing that go bad on them from what i have seen. in my opinion the rhino would be a great gun to start with and it will tackle anything you probably want. riffes are good and one day, but not until mine breaks.


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## Fish-n-Fur

I'm looking too. Has anyone here had, or know someone who has had,experience with Koah Spearguns (www.KoahSpearguns.com)? This guy charters scuba trips and makes his own guns, down near Palm Springs, FL I think. Very user friendly website, but the guns run ~ 200.00 more than a 48"-52"BillerI was thinking about. If you can give an honest comparison/opinion of this gun, to aBiller, I'd like to hearit.The builder states that they super accurate due (to the tight track), easy loading, etc. Wonder if a local dive shop (like MBT :bowdown)would have insight or an experienced comment/opinion on this gun, as well as if they'd have or could get partsfor it...if later needed. I'm looking at getting a single gun that my wife and kids could use too. Thanks and Good Hunting!


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## Fish-n-Fur

p.s. - nice hog pics Wade (Marmidor)! :toast


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## marmidor

Hey Fish-N-Fur i have my DVR set to record SPEARGUN HUNTER.I watched the this weeks show and the guy you are talking about was on the show. Just from what i can see he builds a nice gun.....but what do i know. I think that for now i am going to go with the advice of my PFF brothas. It is good for us new guys that we have this much experience and research that these guys have already done. I have not made any decision on a gun but you can bet on the fact that i will take every piece of advice given and put it to use while making a decision. Which biller are you looking at? As far as the pigs.... thanks the river has been pretty crappy this year with all the rain and i think i have just been preoccupied with diving and spearfishing to hit the hogs! Thanks again to all for your advice and taking the time to share it!

:bowdown:bowdown


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## Florabama

I've got three guns, a 42 biller, a RifeC2x and a 50" Spearfishing Specialties(bought them all at MBT). Ilike the SS the best. It not only reloads faster but due to it's lenght and bans, has more range and power. Whatever gun you get, I would recommend getting thebiggest one you can reload (which is a function of your arm lenght) because the lenght andban size are what gives the gun it's power and range and if you start out fairly small like I did with the biller, you'll soon want to upgrade. I started taking longer shots and taking bigger fish when I got the 50" SS. Fish don't get big because they're stupid and usually won't hang around to give you a perfect shot. Usuallythey're swimming away from youand you only havea second or two to take the shot so, in most circumstances, I thinkrange and power are the most importantfactors.


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## drlile

My final decision came down to either the Riffe #4 or the Ocean Rhino RX 4. Decided on the Ocean Rhino and ordered it from Dive Pro. DP matched the lowest internet price that I could find. I added the kill kit with the muzzle kill spike, grip "T" spike and the spare shaft holder. Will add the third band too. Was watching Speargun Hunter and loved how they had mounted a small dive light on the muzzle kill spike. Perfect for looking under ledges or in holes. I liked the feel of the Ocean Rhino, especially the shape of the grip and the thickness of the trigger; twice the thickness of the JBL or AB Biller. Ocean Rhino RX4 just felt better in my hand than the Riffe. I don't think you can go wrong with either one.


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