# Bummer



## GWally (May 16, 2009)

Ater having a fly fall out of my tackle box some guys from Texas gave me while catcing reds in the back ponds and bayous when I lived in Chauvin and having a guy I ran into at Wmart talk about fly fishing the MS barrier islands, I figured I better dig out the rod I built in the 70's. It is a 3M 100% graphite blank. Unfortunately, the Martin reels I had, a multiplier with a sinking shooting head and "Amnesia" (what they used a lot there) and another with a floating line (7 I think, all I could find at the time) are long gone. I first bought a custom fiberglass rod at a sporting goods store while doing a short tour in Monterey CA. It was ok but, when the guy let me try out his 3M in the parking lot, I was "hooked". 

Unfortunately, when I dug the rod out just now, the aluminum reel seat I used is corroded badly. Looking at some of the "dope" covering where I wrote the description of and signed the rod, I'm pretty sure she was one of many victims to fall to the flood waters of Hurricane Rita. I am soaking the reel seat, trying water now and will do some research to see what may break it free but, chances are it cannot be unstuck.

I was going to look for reel recommendations, now it looks like I will be rod hunting also.

This rod is 9'4" 9 wt and casts like a dream.

I'm looking for recommendations to use off the bow of "the project" boat, offshore, targeting sighted fish. Dolphin for sure but maybe Cobia or ??????? Maybe some Redfish too. I'd built the rod hoping to get back to some Tarpon I left behind off Ponte Vedra (fishing from a 13' ski boat) but, so far that has not materialized.

I'm looking for recommendations as to length and weight. I would not mind going heavier and shorter. The rod I used as a kid with my dad (mid 50's) when we used to tie flies with stuff from Herter's Inc was a 7' Conlon Fiberglass. Pretty much high tech at the time. Dad used some beautiful split bamboo rods. He had one with a permanent bend from a Salmon he caught in Iceland. He caught 2 and brought the smaller one home. Quite a trip, prop "airliner" to Westover AFB and then train to DC (the Porter got him ice and let him keep the fish in one of sinks of a toilet he locked up). Talk about delicious.

I have a ton of new offshore stuff. I am going to use Omoto reels exclusively (probably the most precision crafted reel I have felt). I have a couple of extra new trolling rods and various new reels (one Omoto 22 for sure) left now that I have decided what to use on the boat and would be up for some "horse trading" if anyone is interested (got lots of trolling lures/teasers too). I also may have a couple extra 9 or 10 stainless bearing "bait leader" reels and lots of spools of braid from 20-200#.

No swaps is no problem but, I'd appreciate any recommendations as to rods/reels. I'm sure there must be some out there that are affordable.

BTW, I also have a beautiful FinNor 7 1/2, the real deal not this new stuff on a custom rod from Destin I might part with for a quality set up to get me started.

Also (sorry to be so longwinded), I still have vise and would appreciate getting pointed in the direction of designs and material sources to tie some streamers for attracting those offshore critters.

Thanks in advance for any and all help. 

I can still remember messing around with my rod (not taking it fishing) in a campground in South Louisiana. Hopefully I can find something that will match up to how she behaved. I think it's time to fly fish again. I'm sure my dad would smile down and help me out.


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## GWally (May 16, 2009)

*Albright?*

I just started some reading and have seen some favorable mention of Albright reels. Anyone have experience with the rods? Not being able to try them out like when I first "met" 100% carbon, I know that I appreciat the backbone but, am thinking of maybe 10/11??????


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## timeflies (Oct 3, 2007)

do you want a long or short answer? Because I could go all day on this. I love picking out someone elses gear!


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## GWally (May 16, 2009)

timeflies said:


> do you want a long or short answer? Because I could go all day on this. I love picking out someone elses gear!


How about a short list of rods with "great actions".
I just called McCoys here in Mobile, they have a Sage, Orvis, Triple Fork and Wright McGill and the salesman says we can "go out in the parking lot" to try them. I need to find out what, if any real difference there is. I know that I was totally impressed with the handling of the 3M. That is a 100% graphite blank but, I built it in '75 or thereabouts. I'm guessing that somewhere out there are some rods with excellent action that won't break the bank. My guess is there is just so much you can get out of graphite composites but, may be totally wrong.
I'd be satisfied with a nicely spined rod with a junk reel seat. Since I have to replace one, I'd have no problem doing 2 of them.


As far as reels, my main question is, for what I could expect to catch here in the Gulf, is a single action direct drive the way to go or is it worth having a mulitplier. It was nice getting the line in faster but, I'd guess you lose strength and durability unless you want to spend megabucks. Just a guess.


Just thought of something. How about reel seat and fighting butt design. I have seen designs with a fighting butt extension which I'll put on my rebuild, another, I have seen a second grip, a bit forward of the "normal" grip. Looks like it would be a "nice to have", something to hang onto when the fight is going to take a while.
I saw a rod with this design, and reasonably priced, the Redington Predator. Any idea if it is a decent rod. Is the $800-900 Sage blank that much better?


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## timeflies (Oct 3, 2007)

"Great Action" depends on what you want. I like a faster rod. In my opinion, 
redington is the most underrated rod on the planet. If you watch ebay for a rs4 10wt, it can be had for $100-$125 most days brand new shipped to your door. Best rod in its price range by far, will keep up with most that are twice as expensive, and will whoop nearly every fish you will encounter. I have a feeling the predator is a beast, and will actually be able to review it in January.
Any rod made in '75 has likely been passed up by technology. Go throw a new helios 2, and tell me it isn't like an extension of your body. There is no way on god's green earth that you have ever touched another fly rod with as much feel and as little weight as this back in the 70's. Rods depend on your budget, and I think going out to cast as many as you can is a good idea.
Reels: The short answer is drag. The expensive reels have a cork drag. Abel, Tibor, Pate, etc. Some of the drag designs have stood the test of time. You may remember the old sea masters? I would love to have one. They still fetch a crap pot of cash on ebay, and for good reason. More economical reels can be had, and it is a matter of what company has the most efficient composite drag. The wild card is the "conical drag" touted by lamson. It has been around long enough in reels like the konic that we would know if longevity was an issue. So far, the konic is widely accepted as the best value reel under $150 out there. 
A lot of rods have a removable fighting butt, especially once you hit 12wt and bigger. Which is likely what you want for dolphin and cobia. 
Oh, and Sage makes redington. If that helps at all. Same customer service. 
This was the short answer believe it or not.


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## ditz (Apr 22, 2012)

Take into consideration that most of my tackle is now considered collectable. Those old SA rods were great and I would just replace the current reel seat that is not functioning. A butt can be added and I would advise it on any rod you are considering to use in the salt. The fighting grip above the normal grip can also be added but at some risk. The added top grip can increase the risk of rod breakage IMO if not used correctly. I am not aware of any high quality multiplier reels for the salt but I there may be something that I am not aware of. I will say that the 9wt may not be enough rod large cobia and other blue water fish. I have bought a couple of rods in the last couple of years and they were both Colton. I have also invested in a new salt reel that is also a Colton. TFO also sells some decent moderately priced rods and thier replacement policy is good. If you are really going to use this setup get a reel that is designed to be used in the salt or it will shortly look a lot like your current reel seat. there is a ton of info out there on this so just do a little research on the net and you will learn all you need to choose what you need.:thumbsup:


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## GWally (May 16, 2009)

Thanks for getting back with me. As for my rod, though I built it in the mid 70's, I'm guessing it was pretty much ahead of most stuff out there. 3M only sold these as 2 piece blanks and the action of the pure graphite is nice but, I need to compare it to some of the current ones to find out for sure. Before I go to any lengths replacing the seat (right now, I'm trying some tricks I have researched to try and free it up) I will check out some of the rods available here. I can definitely see that a quality reel is a must and kind of figured any multiplying feature would be a pain in saltwater. 
Looks like the seat will never again function "properly" but, I think I can salvage it enough to at least try the rod out and see how it behaves but, suspect it will be better for Reds. 3M makes good stuff but, even though it is nice and fast, no telling how it would hold up if I got into something with some weight and strength.
I still need to buy another and budget wise found 2 options. A TFO 12 wt, TICR X or for another hundred bucks, a 12 wt Predator. I am leaning towards the Predator since I like the idea of the foregrip and figure they wouldn't have put it there if it was going to mean more broken rods (I have heard that rods are sometimes broken fighting strong fish when the rod is gripped forward of the standard grip to gain some leverage). Gaining leverage sounds good, breaking rod, not so good.
In cruising various sites, both TFO and Redington seem to pop up with some regularity and comments are always favorable.

Flash
Just read a review of the Predator with pics of some pretty strong fish it did battle with. Bottom line was very positive recommendation and a comment about some breakage problems with a line of TFO. Though the TFO is not the same one I was considering, the Predator just looks like it is designed to do what I envision. Gonna go push the button and get one sent my way. 
Now to hunt down a reel.

12 Wt Predator with foregrip should be on the way today or tomorrow. Now for the reel.

I will be looking for something setup since the only lines I have now are in the 9-10 wt range and figure if I can find a decent used 12 wt reel I'll have something to play with.

In my "minds eye" I see tying some streamers that will kind of duplicate yellow bucktail I hooked my first Dolphin on (longer ago than I would care to admit). Any recommendations for material suppliers?

I feel like a "kid in a candy store". Haven't really fly fished since my dad and I did in the late 50's. Itching to get back.


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## lsucole (May 7, 2009)

I have two different multiplier reels, but they are for freshwater ONLY. The reason is the lack of a good drag and there is no saltwater/corrosion protection on them. Ditto the Redington suggestion for an entry level saltwater reel. Also check Cabelas fly fishing section on line- they usually have a better selection than Bass Pro. TFO makes great rods for the price-also has a lifetime warranty. Their 10 wt. Mini-Mag would be a great rod for sight fishing from your boat. Good Luck !


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## tat (Oct 8, 2007)

TFO has had problems with their BVK line - I know cause I've got one of the problem rods (10' 7wt). The TiCrX is a tank, built to fight big fish - you'd have to work really hard to break the 12 wt. I've got a 10 wt and want to use it on Tarpon. I put a Lamson real on it - I really like the conical drag design (& function so far).

I bought the BVK 7wt for wading the beach - I wish I had saved the money and bought a TFO Professional instead. One of my regular fishing buddies uses a Reddington 10' 7wt (not sure which model) for the beach and loves it. Both companies seem to offer a lot of bang for the buck. Although I'm sure I'd spend the money for a high end rod if I had it.


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## tat (Oct 8, 2007)

I saw an add for a 10 TiCrX with Lamson Guru reel w/ line recently (on here?) for $400 - really a good deal.

http://www.pensacolafishingforum.com/f56/fs-10wt-lamson-reel-10wt-tfo-ticr-x-90-a-135962/


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## GWally (May 16, 2009)

Thanks
I really like the idea of the foregrip so went ahead with Predator. I found out my gift from Hurricane Rita was a blessing. I fought with the corroded reel seat, even some diluted sulfuric acid to supposedly dissolve some of the oxide but, no luck. Had the rod out in the sunlight and admiring how I could see the graphite material and something caught my eye. There is what appears to be a couple inch hairline crack down in the graphite fibers just below the stripping guide. I'd bet it would have come apart with the first good fish.
I'm keeping my eye out for a reel. I have another 9 wt I picked up somewhere. It's a 9'6" Daiwa Algonquin. It may be a piece of junk but, it has a fighting butt and the action seems decent. If I run across a reel somewhere with line on it for a decent price, I may just give it a try. I must have bought it when I was getting stuff to outfit "the project". I think I got it with a couple of trolling rods as kind of a throw in.


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## ditz (Apr 22, 2012)

I have an old Diawa fly rod that is a 9' 8wt that I overline and there is nothing wrong with it. It is 30 years old. I am sure it is not as good as the new stuff but my casting ability does not see any difference in castability. It is heavier than current stuff though. The rod did not originally have a fighting butt but I added one when it was new. Somehow over the years the removeable butt has come up missing. Just remember that todays rods do not like high sticking a heavy fish and they will break. 

Good catch on the cracked SA blank. I would have failed probably sooner than later. Too bad though. These rods were expensive in thier day and they are probably somewhat rare. I still have one of the old first series SA reels which were made by Hardy. They don't like the salt very well though.:thumbdown:


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## a (Oct 2, 2007)

The Albrite knot has been around a long time. The Albrite line of fly rods and reels are fairly new...if Im not mistaken.


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## GWally (May 16, 2009)

Did a "bunch" of reading. Reviews on the Konic were outstanding and my main priority for any reel I'm using is the drag and to get the same system in a $110 reel as they put on their high dollar ones shipped looks like a "no brainer". 
I plan on using some of the Spectra Braid I have laying around for backing and need to chase down a line. I have a couple but, not heavy enough. Any recommendations as to type and design. I'm guessing WF but, there are lots of options. I'll most likely put it on the 9 wtrod and when the 12 comes in, look for another reel. I was wondering if this one, #4, would work ok on the 12 wt rod putting on a 12 wt line since I'm guessing I can get plenty of backing using braid. I was reading a writeup on the Orvis Mirage and the "jet plane braking system" drag. Looks pretty impressive and there are some deals out there at less than retail with backing and a quality line. Maybe I can coax Santa out of one.
Thanks
Wally
p.s. Dusting off the old fly tying stuff so I hopefully can create some tasty morsels for offshore.


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## GWally (May 16, 2009)

*12 wt line on the Lamson Konic?*

Moved to new thread


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## GWally (May 16, 2009)

ditz said:


> Take into consideration that most of my tackle is now considered collectable. Those old SA rods were great and I would just replace the current reel seat that is not functioning. A butt can be added and I would advise it on any rod you are considering to use in the salt. The fighting grip above the normal grip can also be added but at some risk. The added top grip can increase the risk of rod breakage IMO if not used correctly. I am not aware of any high quality multiplier reels for the salt but I there may be something that I am not aware of. I will say that the 9wt may not be enough rod large cobia and other blue water fish. I have bought a couple of rods in the last couple of years and they were both Colton. I have also invested in a new salt reel that is also a Colton. TFO also sells some decent moderately priced rods and thier replacement policy is good. If you are really going to use this setup get a reel that is designed to be used in the salt or it will shortly look a lot like your current reel seat. there is a ton of info out there on this so just do a little research on the net and you will learn all you need to choose what you need.:thumbsup:


Spent 2 days searching and researching. Just pushed the button on the Colton for the 12w. Sounds like a good company and a good guy to deal with.


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## ditz (Apr 22, 2012)

I have never used any of the heavy stuff but I am guessing you will be pleased with the Colton reel. I like the 2 rods I have but the 7wt is quite fast and I did overline it with an 8 line. I tried a 9 line but it was too much.:thumbsup: I also have one of the Torrent reels and it sure seems to be excellent but I have not gotten it wet yet and that will tell the tale.


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