# My Invention Finally: The Fishing Mule



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

MOD: Please lock the old thread. After weeks of waiting, and 3 pages of "hurry up", Im sure it's quite stale. Not trying to spam, please lock the old thread so I can start fresh.



UPDATE: JUST FILED WITH US PATENT OFFICE: I can now LEGALLY claim "Patent Pending". Sorry to keep you waiting guys. The waiting is over. I hope you like it.



INTRODUCING THE FISHING MULE



What does a mule do? A mule carries your stuff where you want to go. The fishing mule, carries your stuff, where you want to go. 



Here is a video of the fishing mule in action








Will post still pictures later... enough waiting



Please remember this is a prototype that has been torn apart, changed, put back together, several times. I would not sell this one. It has been grinded on, welded on, beat on, disassembled, reassembled, etc. Some of things will look slightly different when the final product is put together.



You can use this for surf fishing, wade fishing, flounder gigging, crabbing, tow it behind your canoe or kayak for extra space, throw shells and sand fleas in it and let the sand sift out and leave the shells and sand fleas behind. You can take it on the river tubing and put your beer cooler in it. It's got mounting rails and brackets for adding things. You could have a honda generator in this thing and mount lights to it while you wade gig. You can wade fish and take all your stuff out on the water. Put it out there and throw the anchor, set a few rods, crack a beer open. Put four rods in it, grab on the back rail, and swim out to the second sand bar. Deploy all four rods, swim back. Or just throw your anchor and fish four rods right on the sand bar... Cast your mullet net, scoop up a bunch of them empty them right in your cooler in tow. Guys I think of new ideas for this thing all the time. I'm sure there is plenty more I have not thought of. 



Enough for now, I am going to hit the publish button so you can all get off my ass :moon



By the way, this is only one of three versions I am going to manufacture


----------



## JoeZ (Sep 30, 2007)

Pretty cool.



What's the retail/wholesale price range?


----------



## Deep South (Oct 8, 2007)

Looks good.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

I need to figure it out. Don't ask too much of me now lol... It's all I could do to get the paperwork done, videos made, pictures taken, prototype made and tested. I have an idea, but don't want to really throw out an unrealistic number if I'm wrong. I need to get a "quantity" price from the guy who rolls my sheet metal, as that is something I am not equipped to do. I figure if people will pay $200 for a crappy beach cart, this will be at least that expensive. That's all I really should say at this point. I'm still working on wheels for those who want them. It's really ideal for two people to just load it up, and carry it via the built in handles on front and back. Of course one person will either have to make more than one trip, or use wheels.


----------



## jim t (Sep 30, 2007)

VERY NICE!!!

A couple suggestions... 1. Design a wheeled caddy to get it to the beach (I'd make sure it fits through the walkovers on Johnson Beach). It's be nice to load it at the car and wheel it down instead of making 2 to 3 trips.

2. Add more attachment points for lines, tools, etc. If you think 4 is enough, make it 6.

But very impressive!!!: :clap:clapbowdown:bowdown:bowdown

Jim


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *jim t (2/26/2010)*VERY NICE!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




All things I am taking into consideration. The wheels are already in the works. I am not happy with what is available for kayaks and such, so I am designing my own.



More attachments is super easy to do! Thanks for the comments!


----------



## capt'n slim (Feb 8, 2008)

well fellas what we have here is a real live actual freakkin genius. Nice idea i'll bet it's gonna work out real good fer ya. Next week are we gonna see you on that show The Shark Tank? :clap


----------



## Matt Mcleod (Oct 3, 2007)

I like it! Good luck!


----------



## ScullsMcNasty (Oct 4, 2007)

You sir, are the man!!! SOLD!! We should expect a PFF discount though right?!?!?!?:letsdrink


----------



## Runned Over (Sep 6, 2008)

You Sir are......










Remember your PFF friends when your are having swareas (parties) in your Portifino Penthouse!!! :letsdrink

Now you need to make one that'll tow at 30Knts!!!! :clap


----------



## Sequoiha (Sep 28, 2007)

Hey Chris,, fabulous idea,,, shit i didnt know you had it in you,,, lol.. I would bevel the rear toons like the front, since you are anchoring from the stern,,, less splash cause when the waves kick up, that is the direction it will hit the mule,,,,,


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Sequoiha (2/26/2010)*Hey Chris,, fabulous idea,,, shit i didnt know you had it in you,,, lol.. I would bevel the rear toons like the front, since you are anchoring from the stern,,, less splash cause when the waves kick up, that is the direction it will hit the mule,,,,,




If that becomes a problem, I might add some deflectors. 



Angling both ends would ruin my wheel mounting bracket idea for the back... coming soon. Also would increase complexity and decrease bouyancy.


----------



## jim t (Sep 30, 2007)

Anchor from the front?

Jim


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *jim t (2/26/2010)*Anchor from the front?
> 
> 
> 
> Jim




yes you can do that. The attach points are exactly same front and back


----------



## Shankopotamus (Apr 8, 2009)

Great job man! Definately worth the wait!


----------



## SUNDAY-FUNDAY (Apr 17, 2008)

put me on the list for one! i can't wait to see my buddies faces when i wade by them with my ice chest and all my gear behind me!


----------



## Baitcaster (Oct 4, 2007)

First of all , neat idea !



Now , forgive my ignorance but why did you feel the need to get the patent ? I too have been pondering of a more efficient way to more gear to surf/wade fish also . 



Again, that is a neat idea ! Good luck .


----------



## tailfisher (Oct 7, 2007)

that is pretty damn cool, you should have options for it like a seat from sponson to sponson you could sit on like a float tube.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Baitcaster (2/26/2010)*First of all , neat idea !
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Because I put a lot of hard work into it, hundreds of hours of planning, tweaking, building, researching.. etc I've put over 80 hours into it in the last week



I plan on selling it, and I don't want someone ripping me off  An original idea, if its a good one, is valuable and should be protected.


----------



## Fishermon (Oct 19, 2007)

Chris that isa great product. :clap


----------



## SuperSpook (Oct 1, 2007)

Good Idea! I think you would do good with an amphibious/wheeled version like your onto, what got me thinking was you were comparing it to a cart in the video..Thats good but the cart eliminates you from having to lug all your stuff down to the beach, unless it just drags real good or something:letsdrink


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *SuperSpook (2/26/2010)*Good Idea! I think you would do good with an amphibious/wheeled version like your onto, what got me thinking was you were comparing it to a cart in the video..Thats good but the cart eliminates you from having to lug all your stuff down to the beach, unless it just drags real good or something:letsdrink




But a cart doesn't float, so once you have all your stuff at the beach, you have to leave it there... its useless to you when you are wading out 50 yds!





Did you notice the wheel mounting brackets on the back? When my wheel is finished, you won't need a cart EVER. You could even take this to the pier with you.... have an amphibious cart...land, or sea, dont matter.


----------



## SuperSpook (Oct 1, 2007)

> *choppedliver (2/26/2010)*
> 
> 
> > *SuperSpook (2/26/2010)*Good Idea! I think you would do good with an amphibious/wheeled version like your onto, what got me thinking was you were comparing it to a cart in the video..Thats good but the cart eliminates you from having to lug all your stuff down to the beach, unless it just drags real good or something:letsdrink
> ...


Cool, That is what I am saying !! Perfect! I did not notice the brackets :letsparty


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

By the way, I need a kayaker to pull this behind his kayak and tell me what you think. 



Choice of free beach anchor or sand spike for helping me out.


----------



## Jason (Oct 2, 2007)

That's cool...looks purty dern fancy fer shop work!!! I believe the possibilities are endless. You will be a busy man with orders to come!:letsdrink


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Jason (2/26/2010)*That's cool...looks purty dern fancy fer shop work!!! I believe the possibilities are endless. You will be a busy man with orders to come!:letsdrink




I wish I had a shop! lol



I work out of my crowded ass land mine of a garage.


----------



## Private Pilot (Oct 3, 2007)

> *choppedliver (2/26/2010)*By the way, I need a kayaker to pull this behind his kayak and tell me what you think.
> 
> Choice of free beach anchor or sand spike for helping me out.




I'll be happy to do it! Fantastic invention!


----------



## BBob (Sep 27, 2007)

That will be real nice fora mullet fisher w/ a bag net. Very impressive.


----------



## soon to be Capt. Dave (Jun 19, 2009)

Trolling moter and chair?


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *soon to be Capt. Dave (2/26/2010)*Trolling moter and chair?






Dont laugh, that is one of the two models I have not finished yet.


----------



## asago (Nov 11, 2008)

Looks like a neat idea... might consider retractable wheels such as they make with personal watercraft like the one below - that way you don't have to fool with taking them off and on..


----------



## mpmorr (Oct 3, 2007)

I knew it would be worth the wait, great job on the invention, and I hope you make a ton of money on it. If I had a suggestion it would be to keep on going in that direction. Nicely done.:letsdrink


----------



## SaltAddict (Jan 6, 2010)

Man that's awesome! Where's my whiskey still & superswampers. Lol!



Glad to see you got it damn near ready for production. Congrats!:letsdrink


----------



## Play'N Hooky Too (Sep 29, 2007)

If the wheels were mounted on removable tube-metal struts then all you would have to do upon reaching the water would to invert them in the retaining brackets to where they stickup in the air until you needed them again.

Great Invention :clap:letsdrink:usaflag


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *alanbarck (2/27/2010)*If the wheels were mounted on removable tube-metal struts then all you would have to do upon reaching the water would to invert them in the retaining brackets to where they stickup in the air until you needed them again.
> 
> Great Invention :clap:letsdrink:usaflag




Thats exactly how I planned for them to work... exactly. I planned ahead. I could just go ahead and throw any old crappy wheel on them, but I am trying to design my own wheel... something light weight... durable... no air needed

Thats why there is two tubes. There will be no shaft between them, two independent wheels, that can pivot independently, be light weight, and easily stowable on top of the tube when not in use


----------



## Shiznik (Feb 24, 2008)

Looks pretty sweet Chris! You must have tons of other ideas already drawn out just waiting on fabrication. I have a feeling you will be moving that business out of your garage pretty soon. When these products hit the media, watch out, then you'll get swamped with orders and it will be all history from then on out, smooth sailing after you get the production line going. I think all the products are wonderful!

Great job!

Chris


----------



## dsar592 (Oct 12, 2007)

I was surprised at how easily you lifted it and carried it. It must be very light. I like the idea of it having wheels and floating so you you can use it for either application. Great job.


----------



## onemorecast (Feb 16, 2009)

I would buy it in a heart beat!! Freakin awesome!! Nice Job.


----------



## tpshlf (Oct 2, 2007)

Finally

The _CHANGE_ we been waiting for!!!

.

.


----------



## welldoya (Oct 5, 2007)

I don't wade fish but if I did, I would need one of those.

I think your biggest challenge is going to be keeping the price where people will think they've just got to have one. Looks like a lot of metal and welding to me. Also, you keep making references to the beach cart. I don't think they are the competition. Looks like two different target audiences to me.

I would think that your cart would mostly appeal to people who wadefish (or kayak fish)on the sound. It would have to be an awfully calm day to use it on the Gulf. Or so I would think.

You mentioned other products. What I would like to seewould be some kind of contraption to hold 3 or 44' PVC sand spikes on abeachcart without them falling everywhere.

Man, you are always thinking and coming up with good stuff. Congratulations.


----------



## lastcast (Oct 12, 2007)

Looks good Chris, as for wheels, maybe something like the wheels on the back of the old Big Wheel. Not sure if they would turn or plow in the sand though. Maybe? I think you have a winner! Good Luck! Congrats.

Skip


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Shiznik (2/27/2010)*Looks pretty sweet Chris! You must have tons of other ideas already drawn out just waiting on fabrication. I have a feeling you will be moving that business out of your garage pretty soon. When these products hit the media, watch out, then you'll get swamped with orders and it will be all history from then on out, smooth sailing after you get the production line going. I think all the products are wonderful!
> 
> Great job!
> 
> Chris




That would be a great problem to have... and yes, I have about 30 ideas on the drawing board lol


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *welldoya (2/27/2010)*I don't wade fish but if I did, I would need one of those.
> 
> I think your biggest challenge is going to be keeping the price where people will think they've just got to have one. Looks like a lot of metal and welding to me. Also, you keep making references to the beach cart. I don't think they are the competition. Looks like two different target audiences to me.
> 
> ...


You are correct, there is a lot of welding and metal. 

Beach cart, yes it's two different audiences, but not really. They could be the same. With wheels, this thing would go anywhere a beach cart would and hold the same stuff. Imaging going out to pensacola beach pier with your "amphibious beach cart" like something out of a james bond movie. Drive to the water, then drive into the water lol.

As far as gulf is concerned,depends on what you are doing. Big crashing waves? I envision someone putting their rods in the holders, nothing else, grabbing hold of the rear handle, and swimming it out to the second sand bar. They could fish on the bar, or deploy baits , and swim back. The rods arent coming out of the holders. The cargo basket it would be empty. It doesnt hold water, waves would just go right through it

Whats the diameter on your sand spikes?


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *dsar592 (2/27/2010)*I was surprised at how easily you lifted it and carried it. It must be very light. I like the idea of it having wheels and floating so you you can use it for either application. Great job.


Yep... weight was a huge priority. THis thing is 4ft long, 3ft wide, extremely sturdy, yet still lightweight. Making that happen was a very long trial and error process of messing around with different shapes and thicknesses of sheet metal, square tubing, round tubing, channel, angle, etc. The wheels are forthcoming. I rarely go fishing alone, and one thing I think is very handy is the handles on front and back. If two buddies are going fishing, you can load it up and carry it very easy with two people. Or one person can just make two trips. Wheels will be better. Wheels are coming.


----------



## X-Shark (Oct 3, 2007)

Some nice ideas. 



Now you can add a remote control trolling Motor and run it from sitting on the shore. Stick the rods out and have the thing troll your baits, but once you add any kind of a motor it will require a registration number on it.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *X-Shark (2/27/2010)*Some nice ideas.
> 
> Now you can add a remote control trolling Motor and run it from sitting on the shore. Stick the rods out and have the thing troll your baits, but once you add any kind of a motor it will require a registration number on it.


Hey, what you do with it after I make it is your business


----------



## treble (Aug 31, 2009)

i dont think you're going to clear the prior art, and non-obviousness test at the patent office, but it is definately a useful item for fishing. see if you can trademark the name fishing mule. (john deere might be upset)


----------



## Realtor (Oct 1, 2007)

cool thing there. best of wishes.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *treble (2/27/2010)*i dont think you're going to clear the prior art, and non-obviousness test at the patent office, but it is definately a useful item for fishing. see if you can trademark the name fishing mule. (john deere might be upset)


Ive got 200 pages of prior patented items printed out that I researched and nothing came close to this. 

It's not obvious... it's not like going out and getting a plastic tote and dragging it through the water. Even if it were, you can patent new uses for old things. But this is not an old thing. 

It's going to sail right through

Guess someone always has to be a party pooper.


----------



## treble (Aug 31, 2009)

hope your right, its certainly better than the inflatable raft i used to haul by tackle box around this summer.

i second the call for retractable wheels, dragging things through sand is a pain.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Private Pilot (2/26/2010)*
> 
> 
> > *choppedliver (2/26/2010)*By the way, I need a kayaker to pull this behind his kayak and tell me what you think.
> ...




I also need someone to let me borrow their generator and a couple of lights. I want to rig it up as a flounder setup and make a youtube video using it as a wade floundering platform


----------



## true-king (Oct 2, 2007)

> *choppedliver (2/26/2010)*By the way, I need a kayaker to pull this behind his kayak and tell me what you think.
> 
> 
> 
> Choice of free beach anchor or sand spike for helping me out.




I think it would be good to have if you were using a kayak as a means of transport to a wading spot, but I feel like it would get in the way of fishing from the kayak itself.


----------



## johnsonbeachbum (Oct 1, 2007)

> *choppedliver (2/26/2010)*I need to figure it out. Don't ask too much of me now lol... It's all I could do to get the paperwork done, videos made, pictures taken, prototype made and tested. I have an idea, but don't want to really throw out an unrealistic number if I'm wrong. I need to get a "quantity" price from the guy who rolls my sheet metal, as that is something I am not equipped to do. I figure if people will pay $200 for a crappy beach cart, this will be at least that expensive. That's all I really should say at this point. I'm still working on wheels for those who want them. It's really ideal for two people to just load it up, and carry it via the built in handles on front and back. Of course one person will either have to make more than one trip, or use wheels.


Just a thought but you might want to look at aluminum irrigation pipe/tube for the pontoons. Then you just cut to length you desire, no rolling and welding lengthwise.

These guys are manufacturers they make them with .051 to .072 material up to 12" diameter. Might be more cost effictive for you.

http://www.hipco-ne.com/tubing.htm there are others out there.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *johnsonbeachbum (2/27/2010)*
> 
> 
> > *choppedliver (2/26/2010)*I need to figure it out. Don't ask too much of me now lol... It's all I could do to get the paperwork done, videos made, pictures taken, prototype made and tested. I have an idea, but don't want to really throw out an unrealistic number if I'm wrong. I need to get a "quantity" price from the guy who rolls my sheet metal, as that is something I am not equipped to do. I figure if people will pay $200 for a crappy beach cart, this will be at least that expensive. That's all I really should say at this point. I'm still working on wheels for those who want them. It's really ideal for two people to just load it up, and carry it via the built in handles on front and back. Of course one person will either have to make more than one trip, or use wheels.
> ...




Man I have scoured the internet looking for thin wall large diameter tubing. Most metal suppliers stop around 8" with .125 thickness which is way too heavy. I know, I have a bunch of it that I bought for one of my way too heavy prototypes. Thats why I ended up going with the rolled tubing. 



You may have just given me a very valuable contact. Thank you.


----------



## johnsonbeachbum (Oct 1, 2007)

And you do not have to buy it brand new. Many irrigation suppliers have used stuff on hand that was either traded for different stuff or that they bought back to sell again.

Or keep an eye on farm auctions.

This link might give you a source for wheels...https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2348022719175640&item=1-1788&catname=wheels

I use the ones in the link above on my fishing cart as they are all plastic rims and no ball bearings to get sandy or rusty.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *johnsonbeachbum (2/27/2010)*And you do not have to buy it brand new. Many irrigation suppliers have used stuff on hand that was either traded for different stuff or that they bought back to sell again.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Once again, thank you... I should have known to come to pff for advice. The collective knowledge here is amazing


----------



## BananaTom (Feb 16, 2008)

*I was at Chris's home Friday at 3:00 pm to discuss his next project, and saw this thing up close and personal. Great Job!!!!*

*I really like how light is it. I really really like the idea of wheels, then you would be in direct competition with pier carts, That would also float. Heck, if you wheeled thing with big wheel wheels like aforementioned, I believe you would have hottest product on the market.*

*Them you could have them in all the bait stores and quash the competition. *

*Did you see the pier cart tent at Outcast Sale??*

*Next year we want to see your tent there buddy, with sand stakes and the next product we talked about Friday.*

*See Ya!!!!*


----------



## tofer (Oct 7, 2009)

Thats an awesome invention, somewhere between a skiff and and fishing cart. I know its got me interested, thats for sure. Be great for gigging and wade fishing, its just a matter of taking it from a very specific use to making it more universally marketable. Definitely a world of possibilities though. Thinking I'd love it at low tide. To be honest, if its as light as you guys are saying I think I'd use is more as a sled while on the sand, but the wheel be great if hauling across rougher surfaces. Thats the beauty of a pontoon design, it does a great job of distributing weight. If it can be made atless than 50#'s I'll be all over it for surf fishing. Nice job though!


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *tofer (2/27/2010)*Thats an awesome invention, somewhere between a skiff and and fishing cart. I know its got me interested, thats for sure. Be great for gigging and wade fishing, its just a matter of taking it from a very specific use to making it more universally marketable. Definitely a world of possibilities though. Thinking I'd love it at low tide. To be honest, if its as light as you guys are saying I think I'd use is more as a sled while on the sand, but the wheel be great if hauling across rougher surfaces. Thats the beauty of a pontoon design, it does a great job of distributing weight. If it can be made atless than 50#'s I'll be all over it for surf fishing. Nice job though!




less than 50#s? Its about 30.


----------



## tofer (Oct 7, 2009)

Well I stand corrected lol. Thats even sweeter then. Good job man!


----------



## Rat (Oct 3, 2009)

Here is a "non-fishing" idea... You could put a hitch attachment on it and duck hunter could pull it behind their atv/utv in flooded fields to help set decoys etc... and with the wheels a deerhunter could use it as a cart to haul deer or use as small utility trailer etc... The model you spoke of with a trolling motor would be a great item to have to have where people have ponds on the property plus could double as trailer


----------



## Deeplines (Sep 28, 2007)

You are right, I can't believe nobody has thought of it before. I hope you make MILLIONS. :bowdown:bowdown

A pier cart made someone rich, WHY NOT A SURF CART?????


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *tofer (2/27/2010)*Well I stand corrected lol. Thats even sweeter then. Good job man!




Ive gone through about 10 prototypes trying to get weight down... weight was a HUGE priority for me.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Deeplines (2/27/2010)*You are right, I can't believe nobody has thought of it before. I hope you make MILLIONS. :bowdown:bowdown
> 
> 
> 
> A pier cart made someone rich, WHY NOT A SURF CART?????




Thank you, your comments and others are music to my ears.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *tofer (2/27/2010)*Thats an awesome invention, somewhere between a skiff and and fishing cart. I know its got me interested, thats for sure. Be great for gigging and wade fishing, its just a matter of taking it from a very specific use to making it more universally marketable. Definitely a world of possibilities though. Thinking I'd love it at low tide. To be honest, if its as light as you guys are saying I think I'd use is more as a sled while on the sand, but the wheel be great if hauling across rougher surfaces. Thats the beauty of a pontoon design, it does a great job of distributing weight. If it can be made atless than 50#'s I'll be all over it for surf fishing. Nice job though!




You know, I never really thought about how easy it would be to drag it across sand. You are right. The pontoons distribute the weight across a much wider area than wheels, so actually it would be easier to drag it than use wheels... The problem with most wheels is they don't have much surface area, which causes a high pounds per square inch. Which is why the balloon wheels work so good, large surface area, but they are also very expensive



On pavement, piers, bridges, etc, the metal would be eaten up by the abrasion, but on sand, it would glide right across very easily


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *BananaTom (2/27/2010)**I was at Chris's home Friday at 3:00 pm to discuss his next project, and saw this thing up close and personal. Great Job!!!!*
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I didnt make it to the Outcast sale, is it going on tomorrow also? And thank you for the comments. I wish I had more hours in the day I have way more ideas than time!


----------



## curtpcol (Sep 29, 2007)

What a GREAT IDEA !!!! Perfect for the wader,large boater that wants to fish shallow water,the possibilities are endless. Should have no problem getting orders .


----------



## johnsonbeachbum (Oct 1, 2007)

> *choppedliver (2/27/2010)*[
> You know, I never really thought about how easy it would be to drag it across sand. You are right. The pontoons distribute the weight across a much wider area than wheels, so actually it would be easier to drag it than use wheels... The problem with most wheels is they don't have much surface area, which causes a high pounds per square inch. Which is why the balloon wheels work so good, large surface area, but they are also very expensive
> 
> On pavement, piers, bridges, etc, the metal would be eaten up by the abrasion, but on sand, it would glide right across very easily


You might consider adding a strip of UHMW plastic as a sacraficial skid pad or barat the abrasion area of the pontoons. UHMW is a more industrial, abrasion resistant yet <U>slippery</U> plastic better than plastic cutting boards.


----------



## FLbeachbum (Jul 17, 2008)

Dont forget crabing w/wading. Very nice. Good luck.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *FLbeachbum (2/28/2010)*Dont forget crabing w/wading. Very nice. Good luck.




Its on the list at the start of the video


----------



## Wharf Rat (Sep 27, 2007)

Nice work...just a thought, but couldn't you make it cheaper and more easily replace the pontoons if neededif they were made out of some sort of plastic/inflatable/etc. of some type?


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Wharf Rat (2/28/2010)*Nice work...just a thought, but couldn't you make it cheaper and more easily replace the pontoons if neededif they were made out of some sort of plastic/inflatable/etc. of some type?




Do pontoon boats need their pontoons replaced? Not that Ive heard of.

Well my pontoons are STRONGER than BOAT pontoons. Why would they need replacing when mine are stronger and glide through the water versus going 35mph?



There is a number of reasons not to do those option:



Inflatable... ?? Not tough enough. Who wants to pop their pontoon with a hook or gig or sharp barnacles or rocks?



Plastic... I cant weld plastic. I cant fabricate plastic. I cant mold plastic. I cant do anything with plastic. Yeah maybe someone can and maybe I'll license it to someone who can, but I cant.



Aluminum is plenty tough enough. It allows me to make the whole thing from aluminum, super strong, and to weld it all together.



If someone is going to drag it across asphalt repeatedly and wear a hole in it, then they really don't have a lot of sense. And like I said above, mine are stronger than boat pontoons, which people beach on the sand all the time with hundreds of pounds of weight


----------



## Patoz (Oct 12, 2007)

Personally, I think it's almost perfect. There are only two things I would add:

1. Some reflective tape for night opps and a socket of some sort tomount a flag so the jet skiers andboaters can see it better.

2. I definitely see a use for wheels in some applications, but I would make them an option and removable, therefore reducing the weight when not needed at all, as well as the ability to flip up out of the way. 

Another use no one has mentioned yet, is to transport SCUBA equipment. I used to dive some when I was in my 20's (early 70's), but none of us had a boat. We usually dove around the Johnson Beach rock jetties. The only way we couldget there was drive (when it was legal) my 2WD Ford PU on the sand trails are far as it would go, and then carry our gear to the beach, put it in an old Navy one man survival raft, and tow it along the water's edge to the rocks.

Needless to say, we were some tired puppies by the end of the day an we finally made it back to the truck. That raftcouldn't be pulled worth a crap on the sand. 

If this can in fact be towed by a kayak or canoe, I think it would be ideal for divingequipment.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Patoz (2/28/2010)*Personally, I think it's almost perfect. There are only two things I would add:
> 
> 
> 
> 1. Some reflective tape for night opps and a socket of some sort tomount a flag so the jet skiers andboaters can see it better.


Easy enough, its got a bracket for purpose of adding whatever. Its meant to be clamped to, or drilled through, without affecting structural integrity





> 2. I definitely see a use for wheels in some applications, but I would make them an option and removable, therefore reducing the weight when not needed at all, as well as the ability to flip up out of the way.


 That was my thought. Wheels are an option, some people will want them, some wont.







> Another use no one has mentioned yet, is to transport SCUBA equipment. I used to dive some when I was in my 20's (early 70's), but none of us had a boat. We usually dove around the Johnson Beach rock jetties. The only way we couldget there was drive (when it was legal) my 2WD Ford PU on the sand trails are far as it would go, and then carry our gear to the beach, put it in an old Navy one man survival raft, and tow it along the water's edge to the rocks.


Awesome idea!





> Needless to say, we were some tired puppies by the end of the day an we finally made it back to the truck. That raftcouldn't be pulled worth a crap on the sand.
> 
> 
> 
> If this can in fact be towed by a kayak or canoe, I think it would be ideal for divingequipment.


It most certaily can, I will be posting a video this week!


----------



## tofer (Oct 7, 2009)

I would stay away from all the super cheap materials like inflatables and plastics. Its strength and versatility make it most valuable to me and you would lose that by using them. You could add something for durability for the pontoonson sand and such but I doubt you would need it. One part I'm having a hard part envisioning is how I would use it on a pier and other areas. Call me crazy but what if the pontoons were removable? Just some idea's, either way,I want one.You may want to consider going in with a fewpeople to really get it rolling becauseI think this is going to be a big one for inshore fisherman and it won't be long before people are trying to create products to compete with it. Remember imitation is the greatest flattery!


----------



## Death From Above (Sep 28, 2007)

Awesome invention!! Don't know about setting a generator in it with water splashing up through the bottom? Or wading around next to that much voltage. Might be dangerous.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Death From Above (2/28/2010)*Awesome invention!! Don't know about setting a generator in it with water splashing up through the bottom? Or wading around next to that much voltage. Might be dangerous.




yeah, I thought about that, figured you would probably want to set it in a tote, for splash protection. 



I know some people use a tote anyway with batteries and such, but ive had my tote crack before and fill up with water, because they just arent meant to handle the weight. A tote sitting on this thing would keep the generator from getting wet, and keep the tote from failing. Or just use a battery and dont worry about it!


----------



## Death From Above (Sep 28, 2007)

The heat/exaust froma generator would melt a tote. Will make a great 12V float platform.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *tofer (2/28/2010)*I would stay away from all the super cheap materials like inflatables and plastics. Its strength and versatility make it most valuable to me and you would lose that by using them. You could add something for durability for the pontoonson sand and such but I doubt you would need it. One part I'm having a hard part envisioning is how I would use it on a pier and other areas. Call me crazy but what if the pontoons were removable? Just some idea's, either way,I want one.You may want to consider going in with a fewpeople to really get it rolling becauseI think this is going to be a big one for inshore fisherman and it won't be long before people are trying to create products to compete with it. Remember imitation is the greatest flattery!




Not a crazy idea, and I agree with you about the cheap materials. Im not trying to build the cheapest thing on the market, im trying to build the highest quality most versatile thing on the market. 



For Pier, I am envisioning wheels that attach and a handle that attahes. Why make the pontoons removable? It would look weird, but wouldn't get in the way really. Ultimately though, I want it to be good at its primary purpose, towing through the water for wade fishing, crabbing, floundering, etc. If that means it isn't a good solution for the pier, oh well. Thats what pier carts are for. But I do think I could make it a decent substitute in a pinch!



I made a video of it being towed by a kayak today. Thanks private pilot! I had 5 or 6 onlookers going "WTF"??? And they all had very very positive comments. One guy commented how he had definitely never seen anything like that before! 



As far as ramping up production I am trying to figure out how to do that now! Any suggestions ARE EXTREMELY APPRECIATED. Where does one go to find someone who can mass produce something like this? I want to sell TENS OF THOUSANDS, not dozens!, not hundreds!



I should have pricing the next day or two. I would love to hear some input onto much you think would be an appropriate cost. Honest answers on what you would be willing to pay for it ( vs, what you would like to pay for it, we all know we would love to pay as little as possible )


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Death From Above (2/28/2010)*The heat/exaust froma generator would melt a tote. Will make a great 12V float platform.




Got a good point... I guess I could make a light weight aluminum liner/splash guard. Or just stick with 12v! which would be really really handy


----------



## Death From Above (Sep 28, 2007)

Don't forget scalloping. How about anchoring it in you swimming pool for a refreshment station? You could also stick a carseat in there, top it with an umbrellaand take your newborn fishing with you!


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Death From Above (2/28/2010)*Don't forget scalloping. How about anchoring it in you swimming pool for a refreshment station? You could also stick a carseat in there, top it with an umbrellaand take your newborn fishing with you!




HAhaha, the swimming pool is a great idea. 



Had not thought about scallops, but I did think about shrimp, mullet, crabs, crayfish, etc, and in my patent application I mentioned "harvesting of marine and aquatic creatures", which would cover scallops too lol


----------



## hunterfisher (Oct 1, 2008)

how much weight can it support?


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *hunterfisher (2/28/2010)*how much weight can it support?




It has about 180 pounds of buoyancy. It weighs about 30 pounds. That leaves 150 pounds of buoyancy. But you dont want to put 150 pounds on it. It would basically be floating submerged.



I would say about 100 is about as much as you would want to put on it, if evenly distributed. But 100 pounds is a LOT. I need to do some testing on that, I've never had that much on it, even with an ice chest, ice, drinks, bait bucket, tacklebox, reels, etc. Wade fishermen typically go out with a rod and very little else, and since that was the primary design use, any amount of stuff a wade fisherman would want to bring is easily accomodated.



By the way, does anyone know if any freshwater stream/river/lake uses for this? Also, have any of you done fly fishing like they do in the northwest? I'm trying to think of other uses.



I'm already working on different versions of this same concept


----------



## tofer (Oct 7, 2009)

Man some really cool ideas. As for price point I think $299 would be a good starting point once you get them to a production point of actually selling some units. You may want to sell a few to some fellow PFF's for some "field testing" and I think that would definitely help work out any design bugs and perfect your product. Hint Hint oke Not a clue where to look for investors but they are out there, careful though.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *tofer (3/1/2010)*Man some really cool ideas. As for price point I think $299 would be a good starting point once you get them to a production point of actually selling some units. You may want to sell a few to some fellow PFF's for some "field testing" and I think that would definitely help work out any design bugs and perfect your product. Hint Hint oke Not a clue where to look for investors but they are out there, careful though.




That's along the lines of what I was thinking. I was thinking about $325- $375 depending on size, additional features, etc when I get on down the road a little. 



I will try $299 , cash money for PFF'ers. Credit cards orders $10 bucks more



I will have 5 available in the coming week! Now taking orders, first PM, first serve. 



I will also build it with larger pontoons for extra cost. Comes standard with 8 inch pontoons.



9 inch pontoons will add 2.35 pounds of weight, and about 46 additional pounds of buoyancy over the standard model. Extra $25

10 pontoons will add 4.7 pounds of weight, and about 98 additional pounds of buoyancy over the standard model Extra $50



Ive got 5 standard in the works now. Soon as I get the tubes rolled I can finish putting them together. Working on getting them manufactured in quantity also, hopefully I can bring the price down and get them made quicker.


----------



## 69Viking (Oct 30, 2008)

Looks like a great product for sure! Good luck with sales!


----------



## Brant Peacher (Oct 4, 2007)

Very Cool!From a business standpointwith this item,I wouldbe concerned with one thing....CanI getmyproduction costlow enough to where shipping on something that big is not a problem for Retail store.Dealerswill not pay for shipping on an item that big. Therefore, your production cost needs to be low enough to where you cover shipping for the dealer. This won't be the case with local stores so you will have no problem selling a bunch locally.


----------



## johnsonbeachbum (Oct 1, 2007)

If your doing your own welding, you only need a Hossfeld tubing/bar bender and a horizontal band saw or a chop saw for aluminum.

And a drill press.



If you have to farm out any of the fabrication to others, they will make the most profits off of your invention.



Your profit margin will be much better if you can risk purchasing materials at full sticks, full pallets, etc. versus 1zee 2zee purchases.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Brant Peacher (3/1/2010)*Very Cool!From a business standpointwith this item,I wouldbe concerned with one thing....CanI getmyproduction costlow enough to where shipping on something that big is not a problem for Retail store.Dealerswill not pay for shipping on an item that big. Therefore, your production cost needs to be low enough to where you cover shipping for the dealer. This won't be the case with local stores so you will have no problem selling a bunch locally.




I'm not worried about it in the slightest. All those details can be worked out. It happens every day, on tv's washing machines, heavy equipment, etc. 



The thing is, this is only 30 pounds. It's only 4' x 3'. So it's not heavy, just a little bulky. It can be worked out. I've got the good idea, now just to work out the details. 



If I have to buy a freaking truck and drive around delivering them myself, I'm gonna make this work. And you guys are gonna be able to say " I knew choppedliver wayyyyy back when he was a small potater" LOL


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *johnsonbeachbum (3/1/2010)*If your doing your own welding, you only need a Hossfeld tubing/bar bender and a horizontal band saw or a chop saw for aluminum.
> 
> And a drill press.
> 
> ...




You are absolutely right. But I didn't just start gearing up for this a couple weeks ago. This has been going on since last May, so close to a year.



I've invested thousands in tools, and I've already got accounts with 6 wholesale metal distributors. I'm buying metal a couple hundred feet at a time. 



I've got a company in the midwest looking at building the whole thing for me. They are a mill, and a design manufacturer. I'm going to be talking to one in central florida this week. I've got a friend in China who makes boats for a living looking at it too.



You gotta remember, If I can make $25 bucks 100,000 times and do nothing, I'll take that all day long over making $50 and doing all the work... ( hypothetical numbers of course )


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

Havent got my pontoons rolled this week yet. Hoping to get them today. If I cant have a nice and pretty one at the blood drive, the prototype from the video definitely will be at the blood drive tomorrow!!! Let's get some blood donated guys come on out and see us.


----------



## MGuns (Dec 31, 2007)

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">CONGRATULATIONS!!! You are the man. That thing is awesome, you?ve hit a homerun.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *MGuns (3/5/2010)*<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">CONGRATULATIONS!!! You are the man. That thing is awesome, you?ve hit a homerun.




Thank you!!!!



I just got my pontoons today... Well, I got my rolled tubes. I have to weld them myself, put caps on them, build the basket, etc, But Ive got enough for more pontoons. Im working on making pontoons more sleekly shaped to cut water better


----------



## feelin' wright (Oct 7, 2007)

Chopped I sent you a PM. I have a industrial drill press that we need to get rid of. I am sure it will be for pennies on the dollar PM me if you are intrested.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *feelin' wright (3/5/2010)*Chopped I sent you a PM. I have a industrial drill press that we need to get rid of. I am sure it will be for pennies on the dollar PM me if you are intrested.




Got it thanks!



Out of curiosity, I counted up my "inventions list", some are inventions, some are just a better version of something existing already. There is 30 items on it ...:doh:doh:doh:doh:doh Better get busy!


----------



## TWINKIE6816 (Oct 10, 2007)

First off this is very cool! Now, I have 2 possible "extras" you could charge for. The first, I can't believe no one has said yet was a drink holder. You could probably make it out of aluminum your self to keep it high enough and away fromthose small waves. My second idea would be to fill those pontoons with flotation to give it some extra buoyancy for those that would try to make this a smallboat or just for those who have a little more weight to carry.


----------



## Pinksnappertrapper (Dec 7, 2007)

> *TWINKIE6816 (3/5/2010)*First off this is very cool! Now, I have 2 possible "extras" you could charge for. The first, I can't believe no one has said yet was a drink holder. You could probably make it out of aluminum your self to keep it high enough and away fromthose small waves. My second idea would be to fill those pontoons with flotation to give it some extra buoyancy for those that would try to make this a smallboat or just for those who have a little more weight to carry.


Excellent idea, Maybe some type of foam like they fill boats with. Again GREAT idea.


----------



## Baitcaster (Oct 4, 2007)

Pensacola Kayak and Sail should have a demo day coming up some , would be a good opportunity to show off the concept to yakers that don't visit this forum .


----------



## BIGRIGZ (Oct 2, 2007)

> *Pinksnappercatcher (3/5/2010)*
> 
> 
> > *TWINKIE6816 (3/5/2010)*First off this is very cool! Now, I have 2 possible "extras" you could charge for. The first, I can't believe no one has said yet was a drink holder. You could probably make it out of aluminum your self to keep it high enough and away fromthose small waves. My second idea would be to fill those pontoons with flotation to give it some extra buoyancy for those that would try to make this a smallboat or just for those who have a little more weight to carry.
> ...




Wouldn't filling them up with foam only do something if the aluminum pontoon leaked?

I mean isn't an airtight pontoon going to providemore bouyancythan an airtight pontoon filled with foam?


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *TWINKIE6816 (3/5/2010)*First off this is very cool! Now, I have 2 possible "extras" you could charge for. The first, I can't believe no one has said yet was a drink holder. You could probably make it out of aluminum your self to keep it high enough and away fromthose small waves. My second idea would be to fill those pontoons with flotation to give it some extra buoyancy for those that would try to make this a smallboat or just for those who have a little more weight to carry.




Drink holder is already in the works. I just didnt have the right sized tubing! I got it today


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *BIGRIGZ (3/5/2010)*
> 
> 
> > *Pinksnappercatcher (3/5/2010)*
> ...




DING DING we have a winner. Some of you guys need to back to skool for some physics lessons ! 



FOAM DOES DOES NOTHING FOR BUOYANCY!!! IT ONLY KEEPS SOMETHING HEAVY OUT... ie WATER, in case of a LEAK.



FOAM ITSELF WEIGHS SOMETHING... NOT VERY MUCH, BUT SOMETHING! I just talked to a guy today with a big pontoon boat, he put 280 POUNDS OF FOAM in his pontoons. Now ask yourself, IS 280 POUNDS OF FOAM GONNA MAKE IT HOLD MORE ??? No, it will DECREASE the buoyancy by 280 pounds!!!!!!



The only think that would make it LIGHTER is somethign LIGHTER THAN AIR. And the only reason it would do that is because you would replace the AIR FILLED Pontoons with something lighter than the air already in them, IE helium, and it would be an INSIGNIFICANT amount.



So repeat after me:



_BUOYANCY IS EQUAL TO THE WEIGHT OF THE WATER PUSHED OUT OF WAY BY THE OBJECT ( PONTOON ) MINUS THE WEIGHT OF THE OBJECT DOING THE PUSHING ( PONTOON). _



Nothing else, Nada. Period. You want the pontoons to be filled with the LIGHTEST thing possible. And foam is way heavier than air. It will only keep your pontoon from filling with water, which would obviously sink the craft. 



You are not going to sink the fishing mule just pulling it behind you. A motorized pontoon boat is another story.


----------



## Patoz (Oct 12, 2007)

choppedliver,

You are 100% correct. The only thing that makes foam float, or work as insulation for that matter, is the air trapped in the bubbles encased by the foam material. Replacing the air with something like Hydrogen or Helium would make it lighter, but you still have to consider the additional weight of the foam material itself.

I was going to suggest drink holders also, but someone beat me to it.

I think you are on the right track. After all, look what this guy did... http://www.cruzincooler.com/index.html


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *Patoz (3/5/2010)*choppedliver,
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Thank you for your support! I hope I can do as well as him!


----------



## johnsonbeachbum (Oct 1, 2007)

> *choppedliver (3/5/2010)
> 
> Thank you!!!!
> 
> ...


*



Maybe look into squeezing the ends together like the end of a toothpaste tube. Maybe at an angle but really would not make any difference if it was straight up and down. It ain't gonna be going 50 mph.

Then you have no additional plate to fit and weld onto the ends, just on vertical weld across the compressed ends.

Although it might be tough to keep the ends looking right, lol.*


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *johnsonbeachbum (3/6/2010)*
> 
> 
> > *choppedliver (3/5/2010)
> ...


*





Thats the whole thing... its not a high speed craft. I had one cut at the "toothpaste" tube angle last week, going to build it this week and see how that works. I like the first desing because the angled flat front keeps the nose out of the water.*


----------



## BBreeze (Aug 26, 2009)

If you are intrested in building one to ride I have one you are more than welcome to get some ideas from. I will post some pic'stommorrow.


----------



## David Ridenour (Sep 28, 2007)

Very nice idea. How about athreaded hole on one or both pontoons so you could have a removable "hatch" or port to put valuables inside the pontoon to keep dry? If the stern ends are flat it seems it wouldn't be too hard. They would hold ultra light rods in tubes pretty easy. A couple of large boat fenders tied to the bottom would increasebuoyancy if the customer so desired. Just add it in the instructions. Just a thought.

Someone mentioned diving. A few years ago I saw an apparatus that was basically a compressor mounted on an improved innertube with thirty foot hoses and regulators attached. It followed a diver or two while they snorkeled along and allowed them to dive to near thirty feet.


----------



## BBreeze (Aug 26, 2009)

Here are a few pic's of my one man fishing machine. As you can see it has not been used in a while, but it is the best floundering and bush hook fishing rig I have personally tried. Only treads 6" loaded(battery, tolling motor, icechest, and passenger)weight isabout a 100 pound and is 7' long by 4' wide so it will fit in a full size truck bed.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *BBreeze (3/8/2010)*Here are a few pic's of my one man fishing machine. As you can see it has not been used in a while, but it is the best floundering and bush hook fishing rig I have personally tried. Only treads 6" loaded(battery, tolling motor, icechest, and passenger)weight isabout a 100 pound and is 7' long by 4' wide so it will fit in a full size truck bed.




Very cool, very similar to something Im working on ... guess great mines think alike. 



I got my metal for cupholders today... working on wheels too... and sand flea rakes... and and and lol...


----------



## ADRENALINE (May 6, 2008)

did you not receive my pm?


----------



## Midnight Rider (Sep 30, 2007)

Looks great. Just one thing I will point out since you asked. I would make the holder on the side where you have the fillet knife deeper so as you dont have knife point sticking out of the bottom. Might not be good if boat bumps into you while wading and jabs you in the leg.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

> *ADRENALINE (3/8/2010)*did you not receive my pm?




I did... just didnt respond right away ... will get back to you... have had so many pms and been so busy hard to keep things straight


----------



## Death From Above (Sep 28, 2007)

> *Midnight Rider (3/8/2010)*Looks great. Just one thing I will point out since you asked. I would make the holder on the side where you have the fillet knife deeper so as you dont have knife point sticking out of the bottom. Might not be good if boat bumps into you while wading and jabs you in the leg.


Good catch. Would be better if the knife was up out/away from the water all together, maybe put the knife holder on the side of the main frame?


----------



## Reel Sick (May 4, 2009)

*Add a Bimini Top lol keep your tackle cool and out of the sun. How spill prof is it to boat wakes? Looks great!! Good Trout fishing machine. Keep up the good work good luck to ya.*


----------



## Patoz (Oct 12, 2007)

> *David Ridenour (3/7/2010)*Very nice idea. How about athreaded hole on one or both pontoons so you could have a removable "hatch" or port to put valuables inside the pontoon to keep dry? If the stern ends are flat it seems it wouldn't be too hard. They would hold ultra light rods in tubes pretty easy. A couple of large boat fenders tied to the bottom would increasebuoyancy if the customer so desired. Just add it in the instructions. Just a thought.
> 
> Someone mentioned diving. A few years ago I saw an apparatus that was basically a compressor mounted on an improved innertube with thirty foot hoses and regulators attached. It followed a diver or two while they snorkeled along and allowed them to dive to near thirty feet.


That is called a 'Hooka' Diving Rig. This is Brownie's version.










I have the engine/compressor part, but that's all. Maybe one day...


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

now with cupholders, front and back



















The final design will be very slightly different. This is the location


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

So I have been working on my shed... my garage is so packed full of crap, I just can't work so things have been put to the side.

Started working on a wheel design today... These wheels were $40 from harbor freight. Not the perfect solution, but readily available. Looked at some online, but the shipping cost offset the savings. 

Anyway, tried these out ... work great, just gotta go get some cotter pins and stuff. They stow away when not in use. Willpost more pics later as well as a video


----------



## MGuns (Dec 31, 2007)

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">I saw the Mule recently and that thing is awesome. Great job on it.


----------



## choppedliver (Apr 4, 2009)

Wheels when not being used, up and out of the way:










And when in use, just flip them over, grab handle and go:


----------



## Shiznik (Feb 24, 2008)

The customizing of it is what makes it even more unique. There are so many different uses for it and it just keeps getting better each day! Great job!


----------



## fishinknots (Feb 26, 2010)

> *choppedliver (2/26/2010)*
> 
> 
> > *soon to be Capt. Dave (2/26/2010)*Trolling moter and chair?
> ...


I was gonna say chair, but someone beat me to it..... Great work!!


----------

