# winchester model 1897



## pop-n-chick (Feb 24, 2011)

so ive got an old WINCHESTER MODEL 1897 circa 1910-1913. the old girl is in pretty good shape considering its age,bore is bright,action is tight.chambers and ejects shells fine .My question is would it be safe to shoot modern ammo thru it? its a 12 gauge ,full choke, 28 inch barrel. thinking mabye trying some low brass target loads,,whadda ya;ll think???I understand these shotguns are kinda rare and i dont wanna hurt myself or the gun...


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## Clayjunky (Feb 17, 2010)

Take it to a licensed gunsmith before shooting ANYTHING... get their feedback, then proceed....my 2 cents


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## pop-n-chick (Feb 24, 2011)

*winchester*

thanks clay, can you recommend any gunsmiths close to us, im right across the bridge from you


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## snapperfan (Aug 30, 2009)

The 97 was made all the way through 1957 and designed for smokeless powder so if mechanically sound it should be fine to shoot.

You can learn more about them on the Winchester Collectors website
http://www.winchestercollector.org/guns/1897shot.shtml

and maybe even trace the serial number here:
http://www.bbhc.org/firearms/records/

Sweet old gun. Hang on to it.


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## bigbulls (Mar 12, 2008)

So long as it is in good working order fire away. Guns don't go bad just sitting there unless they are allowed to rust. It amazes me how many people think that old guns are somehow gonna blow up if you shoot them. They shot fine then they shoot fine now.

Do not shoot steel or hevishot through it.


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## pop-n-chick (Feb 24, 2011)

thanks man,good info and yes its cool old gun


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## kaferhaus (Oct 8, 2009)

No problem at all. I've had one for nearly 20yrs and use it as a "loaner" for friends and visitors. It's had thousands of shells fired through it during that time.


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## SAWMAN (May 24, 2010)

*It Amazes Me......*

......that it amazes you to think that some of the older guns WILL NOT blow up if you do not do your homework before grabbing the first ammo that comes to mind and giving it a try. 

But you are right about one thing. Guns do not go bad just sitting there. They are manufactured weak. Strong for their day...weak for our day. 

There has also been alot of change in propellents in the last 75 years. They have become more powerful so as to keep up with the advancements in the manufactureing process. 

When in doubt....check it out. Ya'll stay safe out there. ---- SAWMAN


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

SAWMAN said:


> ......that it amazes you to think that some of the older guns WILL NOT blow up if you do not do your homework before grabbing the first ammo that comes to mind and giving it a try.
> 
> But you are right about one thing. Guns do not go bad just sitting there. They are manufactured weak. Strong for their day...weak for our day.
> 
> ...


AGREE - 12 gauge is still 12 gauge but the newer powders may produce more pressure that they didn't manufacture for 75 yrs ago . I think it's fine but Be Safe - do a little research


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## bigbulls (Mar 12, 2008)

> ......that it amazes you to think that some of the older guns WILL NOT blow up if you do not do your homework before grabbing the first ammo that comes to mind and giving it a try.
> 
> But you are right about one thing. Guns do not go bad just sitting there. They are manufactured weak. Strong for their day...weak for our day.
> 
> There has also been alot of change in propellents in the last 75 years. They have become more powerful so as to keep up with the advancements in the manufactureing process.





> AGREE - 12 gauge is still 12 gauge but the newer powders may produce more pressure that they didn't manufacture for 75 yrs ago . I think it's fine but Be Safe - do a little research


First, I never said that old guns will not blow up. I said *so long as the gun is in good working order then fire away.
*
Second, powders may be more powerful, cleaner, more consistent, less effected by temperature extremes, etc... etc... but Saami specifications for 12 gauge chamber pressures (11,500 psi for 2.75" and 3" and 14,000 psi for 3.5") have not changed in the last 75 years. Regardless of what powders the manufacturer uses today they are regulated to maximum average chamber pressures just as they were 75 years ago. These maximum average pressures are standardized so that ammunition will be safe to fire the strongest of modern firearms as well as the weakest of past firearms that were designed for smokeless powder. 

A 2 3/4" shell today is loaded to the same pressures as they were 75 years ago. 

Guns that are "weak" are/were generally designed for black powder which produces much lower chamber pressures than smokeless powders. The Winchester model 1893 was such a firearm but the Winchester 97 is not and will fire any modern 2 3/4" 12 gauge shell.

If you guys want to read a few things about pressures, case and chamber dimensions, ammunition and firearms standards, etc... see the link below.
http://www.saami.org/specifications_and_information/index.cfm


*pop-n-chick*, sorry if it sounded like I was picking on you. I wasn't. Your gun, if in good mechanical condition, is perfectly safe to fire todays 2.75" shells through it so long as you shoot lead and not hevishot or steel. While the HV or steel will not harm the action or create an unsafe condition it is hard and does not deform like lead does and can harm the barrel or split the barrel at the muzzle.


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## SAWMAN (May 24, 2010)

*Sez Me*

Without sounding argumenative I would say the following. 

SAAMI was not even thought of when his weapon was produced. There was NO WAY to test for pressures in firearms when his gun was produced. The weapon was made,the ammo was made and tested in the gun(I would think). If the gun did not blow up,it was good to go.

I understand SAAMI and their role in "modern" firearms testing,evaluation,and certification. If this will make you think that you can take an older shotgun(maybe with a damascus bbl),a SAA revo chambered in 45Colt(LC),or even an older DA gun and stuff it full of the modern SAAMI spec(up to max)ammo,have at it. I will not, nor will I openly advocate others to do it. Especially if I have never seen his weapon,know for sure that his weapon is actually what he sez it is,or even looking at the condition of his weapon with my own eyes using a high powered light. 

MY usual response to questions like this(with all due respect to the owner)is simply,"I would reccomend that you take it to a qualified gunsmith before loading it OR fireing it. 

Also remember that there has been different chamberings out for some time(mostly wildcat) that SAAMI has not, and will not put a pressure rateing on. Be super carefull of these.

Allow me to state again.....Ya'll be safe out there. ---SAWMAN


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## oldflathead (Oct 3, 2007)

*Model 1897 &*

Did you say Winchester 97? I bought mine in 1952, Baldwyn, MS after working hard all summer bailing hay, cutting pulp wood and whatever I could do to earn enough money to buy it. I still have it, as well as a replica riot gun Model 97.








After three years of hunting I enlisted in the Marine Corps in 1955. First Parris Island, Camp LeJuene, then Great Lakes NTC North Chicago for electronics school. After the school, while awaiting assignment I was temporarily assigned as a brig guard/prisoner chaser. Guess what weapon I was assigned? A Model 97 riot gun. An old friend that I was very familiar with. Once I had three brig rats out trimming grass along the fences, when one smart ass says, "Hey boy what you gonna do if I run?" I pumped a round into the chamber and said, "Run mf, run." Never had any problems after that.:thumbup:

BTW, it is one pump that you can hold the trigger down, keep pumping and it keeps firing. Dangerous if you don't know that.

Love my 97s.

The knife between the two shotguns was made by my Father-In-Law, who was also a Marine, from Corsair (F4U) parts he salvaged while on Peleliu, 1944, VMF 121. 

Semper Fi 
Tom


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