# Just got a call from FWC



## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

I had written my FL congressman and senator hoping a change could be made to allow the use of a bream as bait on a set line. All they did was forward my request instead of trying to take any action. I didn't want the FWC to call me I wanted the law changed.

The man that called was very nice. While I had his attention I asked plenty of questions. His reasoning why the use of a bream on a set line would never be changed is because you cannot use set lines to catch gamefish. I told him I didn't want to catch a gamefish I wanted to use it for bait. He let me know it wasn't going to happen. So even though the FWC wants the flathead removed you can't use their favorite food as bait.

I also made sure the way I marked my lines is correct. He said 90% of the people don't mark their lines at all so I am way ahead of them. He did clarify that if you have a gamefish in your boat you better not have a bush hook, trotline or even a castnet.

One thing the FWC is trying to pass is that you cannot legally release a flathead. He said the rod/reel guys are fighting it. Of course you will have to be caught in the act to be ticketed so the chances of that happening is slim. I hope it passes so we can rid our rivers of this invasive species. 

Oh well I thought I would give it a try. To bad I didn't get the answer I was looking for.


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## sureicanfish (Sep 30, 2007)

They list bream as gamefish right?


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## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

Yes


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## sureicanfish (Sep 30, 2007)

Dumb


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

So what if you put out a trot line baited with wigglers and thru no fault of yours a bunch of bream bite the wigglers and hook themselves on your line, and before you have a chance to check it a bunch of flatheads eat those bream that you don't know nothing about?

At least that's a good story for the judge!


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## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

The man told me the reason we would never be able to use a bream on a set line in Florida is because the FWC don't want you to catch a gamefish on a set line. I told him that doesn't make sense. I don't want to catch gamefish I want to use them for bait. I explained to him that I have caught a few nice bass on my bush hooks using shiners for bait which is legal. A bass will eat a shiner before he would eat a big bream.

I thought writing my local representatives would help get me a logical answer to why we can't use a bream for bait. All they did was pass the hat.

He did talk about not releasing a flathead back into the river after being caught. He said there are numerous tournaments in the panhandle and the fish that were caught could feed many needy people if they weren't released. He talked about how a 10# female will lay a million eggs and how we need to remove as many of these from the rivers as possible. I told him I would be glad to do my part if I could use their favorite food for bait.


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## John B. (Oct 2, 2007)

10 pager once cathunter reads this...


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## lastcast (Oct 12, 2007)

billyb said:


> Yes


BB, if I'm understanding it right, he said you can't set bush hooks for "Game Fish". Their thought, meaning if you use bream you have a better chance at catching "Game Fish". Which is against the Law. So, lets just outlaw bream. On things like this instead of taking what the law says, we should look at "intent". As sportsmen we all agree to a point. Some we agree, some we just don't know enough about. They're not making all bad calls, but if you base your reasoning on collected data, your going backwards. Look forward for all the kids, and I don't even have any! Lobby together and Ya'll have a voice, sometimes.


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## JoeyWelch (Sep 25, 2009)

They're not that hard to catch on rod n reel. And a lot more fun.

I wouldn't plan on the rivers being rid of them anytime soon though.


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## JoeyWelch (Sep 25, 2009)

Oh yeah, almost forgot.

*River Rapers!*


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## DMC (Nov 28, 2010)

billyb said:


> The man told me the reason we would never be able to use a bream on a set line in Florida is because the FWC don't want you to catch a gamefish on a set line. I told him that doesn't make sense. I don't want to catch gamefish I want to use them for bait. I explained to him that I have caught a few nice bass on my bush hooks using shiners for bait which is legal. A bass will eat a shiner before he would eat a big bream.
> 
> I thought writing my local representatives would help get me a logical answer to why we can't use a bream for bait. All they did was pass the hat.
> 
> He did talk about not releasing a flathead back into the river after being caught. He said there are numerous tournaments in the panhandle and the fish that were caught could feed many needy people if they weren't released. He talked about how a 10# female will lay a million eggs and how we need to remove as many of these from the rivers as possible. I told him I would be glad to do my part if I could use their favorite food for bait.




That's all BS. All the years I've fish using trot lines or set hooks I've never caught a game fish.
They don't want the flat heads but want let you use the food of their choice. 
Making a bream a game fish is also BS.


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## RMS (Dec 9, 2008)

Gooberment.


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

I caught this dude Thursday night - I woulda like to donate him to Billyb but given the situation I cut him into 24 bite size nuggets and put him on a trot line tied to the dock and recycled him into 6 nice channel cats! Is that a skipjack?


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## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

If I could get some of those and a few of those shiners like sureicanfish caught I would have all of the flathead bait I need.


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

I ended up catching 2 on crappie jigs around my dock light. Think I coulda caught several if I had thrown the net. Both were 13" long.


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## sureicanfish (Sep 30, 2007)

Try a sabiki, watch it on youtube


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

Here's what they were after. Look close! Don't know what they are but they musta just hatched out. There were at least double infinity of them under the dock


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## bowdiddly (Jan 6, 2010)

billyb said:


> I had written my FL congressman and senator hoping a change could be made to allow the use of a bream as bait on a set line. All they did was forward my request instead of trying to take any action. I didn't want the FWC to call me I wanted the law changed.
> 
> The man that called was very nice. While I had his attention I asked plenty of questions. His reasoning why the use of a bream on a set line would never be changed is because you cannot use set lines to catch gamefish. I told him I didn't want to catch a gamefish I wanted to use it for bait. He let me know it wasn't going to happen. So even though the FWC wants the flathead removed you can't use their favorite food as bait.
> 
> ...


The reason the your congressman and senator just forwarded your request is due to the fact that they do not have any jurisdiction over FWC.
Your Fl State Rep and or state senator would be the ones to write to.


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## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

I wrote to Doug Broxson and Greg Evers. The man that called said he was contacted by Mr. Evers office. He said that they wanted to make sure I was contacted about my concern.


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## bowdiddly (Jan 6, 2010)

billyb said:


> I wrote to Doug Broxson and Greg Evers. The man that called said he was contacted by Mr. Evers office. He said that they wanted to make sure I was contacted about my concern.


Sounds good.....your post indicated you wrote your congressman and senator, so I thought you had contacted the feds.
At least the state responded to your inquiry.


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## CatHunter (Dec 31, 2008)

Flathead’s have been in Florida for over 30 years now; our rivers are healthier today than they have ever been. The rivers are slam loaded with monster bluegills and shell crackers. 

Flatheads are only native to the Major Rivers like the Mississippi and Alabama Rivers, every other water way that has flatheads they are not native. One thing all these systems have in common is they are all very healthy today. Flatheads are the balancing factor in removing weak and overpopulated sunfish creating a much better fishery in the end. It’s been proven over and over again.

Ignorance and lack of understanding the history of these fish is what plagues Florida. 
No other organization in this country has a bigger voice than ours about flatheads. Flathead Catfish Hunters now reaches over a half million people a week. One thing you can bet is change is coming to Florida and its already underway.

http://www.flatheads.us/the-florida-flathead-invasion


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## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

The only change I want is to be able to use a bream for bait legally. The FWC wants change too. They want it to be illegal to release a flathead after it is caught.


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## rustybucket (Aug 18, 2011)

I caught a largemouth on chicken liver one time, they should ban that on set lines too!!


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## CatHunter (Dec 31, 2008)

billyb said:


> The only change I want is to be able to use a bream for bait legally. The FWC wants change too. They want it to be illegal to release a flathead after it is caught.


That's incorrect I can promise you that. There might be some guy on the team that does but as a whole they could really careless. Remember when they banned jug fishing in Florida because jug runners didn't follow the rules? The same could happen very soon to bush-hooks. FWC are getting tired of cutting them down. 

Now that flatheads occupy Black water and cold-water creek its just a matter of time before a tuber floats into a hook left behind. The up-roar will be tremendous.


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## CatCrusher (Jan 18, 2009)

CatHunter said:


> That's incorrect I can promise you that. There might be some guy on the team that does but as a whole they could really careless. Remember when they banned jug fishing in Florida because jug runners didn't follow the rules? The same could happen very soon to bush-hooks. FWC are getting tired of cutting them down.
> 
> Now that flatheads occupy Black water and cold-water creek its just a matter of time before a tuber floats into a hook left behind. The up-roar will be tremendous.


I'll assure you they want them kept!! I'm I'm always willing to help!

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## CatHunter (Dec 31, 2008)

CatCrusher said:


> I'll assure you they want them kept!! I'm I'm always willing to help!
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


Old ways of thinking. 

After 30 years all of the eradication programs have ended, and I personally have friends in the FWC and speak to many of the biologist. We are about to take them off the invasive species list. Then just like Alabama did we are going to implement regulations in Florida on Catfish. Big Changes are coming, ill keep you guys updated.


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## CatCrusher (Jan 18, 2009)

CatHunter said:


> Old ways of thinking.
> 
> After 30 years all of the eradication programs have ended, and I personally have friends in the FWC and speak to many of the biologist. We are about to take them off the invasive species list. Then just like Alabama did we are going to implement regulations in Florida on Catfish. Big Changes are coming, ill keep you guys updated.


If you think that regulation on catfish in Alabama made a difference you've bumped your head. 

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## CatCrusher (Jan 18, 2009)

CatHunter said:


> Flathead’s have been in Florida for over 30 years now; our rivers are healthier today than they have ever been. The rivers are slam loaded with monster bluegills and shell crackers.
> 
> Flatheads are only native to the Major Rivers like the Mississippi and Alabama Rivers, every other water way that has flatheads they are not native. One thing all these systems have in common is they are all very healthy today. Flatheads are the balancing factor in removing weak and overpopulated sunfish creating a much better fishery in the end. It’s been proven over and over again.
> 
> ...


I'm glad to see its healthy again lol. Time for me to get some lines out.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## gastonfish (Mar 24, 2012)

Bush hooking is bad enough as it is. To those that follow the rules and take them up after you use them awesome and no one has an issue with it. But there are man more that don't and don care at all. There are old hooks hanging in every bush on every river I know especially yellow. There are other fish that you can use for bush hooking that work just as good if not better than bream. And thank god sunfish are a game fish- just think how bad it would be if they were not regulated.


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

Some body's fixen to get called a river raper!


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## FishWalton (Jul 22, 2010)

CatHunter said:


> Flathead’s have been in Florida for over 30 years now; our rivers are healthier today than they have ever been. The rivers are slam loaded with monster bluegills and shell crackers.
> 
> Flatheads are only native to the Major Rivers like the Mississippi and Alabama Rivers, every other water way that has flatheads they are not native. One thing all these systems have in common is they are all very healthy today. Flatheads are the balancing factor in removing weak and overpopulated sunfish creating a much better fishery in the end. It’s been proven over and over again.
> 
> ...


Glenn.....you say "One thing all these systems have in common is they are all very healthy today. Flatheads are the balancing factor in removing weak and overpopulated sunfish creating a much better fishery in the end. It’s been proven over and over again."

Please tell us where to find this proof.....not just hearsay, rhetoric, opinion, but scientific proof. I keep hearing flathead enthusiast say this stuff but have yet to see any credible evidence. A scientific study over several years in South Caroline proved just the opposite. Where a major river bream fishery declined dramatically it rebounded dramatically when tons and tons of flatheads were removed by the state. What say you?


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

I'm so excited to hear the answer! I'm gonna kill my battery!


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

Well - while we wait y'all check out tonight's supper. That's grilled channel cat (trot line) baked potatoes and steamed squash and broccoli. That catfish cooked on the cast iron griddle on the green egg is some of the best fish I've ever eat


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## CatCrusher (Jan 18, 2009)

By the way sureicanfish your package is on the way.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## FishWalton (Jul 22, 2010)

With cook'n like that we are ready for that PFF bash and fish feed at your place


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## sureicanfish (Sep 30, 2007)

Catcrusher: sweet!!

Try'n: when we come up will you cut up my tater for me?


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

sure said:


> Catcrusher: sweet!!
> 
> 
> 
> Try'n: when we come up will you cut up my tater for me?




I will if you will bring cat crushers mystery package with you. I'm guessing I could use it!


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## jcoss15 (Oct 11, 2010)

I like setting lines for meat, rod and reel for sport, it's really that simple. I do get tired of all the old hooks hanging from trees though, especially when casting for bass. I value my bush hooks too much than to just leave them tied to a tree, got to much money and time in them...


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## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

I posted what the FWC told me. I don't think Cathunter and his organization has as much clout with the FWC as he thinks he does. 

It makes me mad that a few people who set lines don't follow the rules. Some people who hunt don't follow the rules. That doesn't mean those of us that still enjoy old traditions want them stopped.


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

billyb said:


> It makes me mad that a few people who set lines don't follow the rules. Some people who hunt don't follow the rules. That doesn't mean those of us that still enjoy old traditions want them stopped.



I agree but most laws/rules that are made involving fishing and hunting are either because of someone abusing the resource or someone wanting to manipulate the resource for personal gain. Think about it


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## CatCrusher (Jan 18, 2009)

Try'n Hard said:


> I agree but most laws/rules that are made involving fishing and hunting are either because of someone abusing the resource or someone wanting to manipulate the resource for personal gain. Think about it


Personal gain more than anything else.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## sureicanfish (Sep 30, 2007)

I found a trotline while throwing a beetlespin the other day, maybe 100 feet long, hung a few feet below the surface, no hooks, no weight, just tied off...so, a snagline..


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## billyb (Aug 22, 2012)

I cut every line I see when bass fishing in the river if they look like they have been there a while. You can tell if they have been abandoned. Algae on the line or rusty hooks. Got a lot of good lead from them. Another thing that I can't stand is leaving marking tape hanging in the bushes.


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## Try'n Hard (Oct 23, 2008)

You take a chance cutting lines. I've met several guys who run lines over the weekend , leave them out, then bait them up the next Friday. I don't like it - but if the guys I met catch you somethings gonna get cut and it won't be their line! I cut down a few but get the chance to track them more than most. I will get your bush hooks and banked noodles pretty quick. I love my Great White Egrits and they get tangled in them so they gotta go! Counted 23 of these beauties from my dock Saturday morning


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## gastonfish (Mar 24, 2012)

billyb said:


> The man told me the reason we would never be able to use a bream on a set line in Florida is because the FWC don't want you to catch a gamefish on a set line. I told him that doesn't make sense. I don't want to catch gamefish I want to use them for bait. I explained to him that I have caught a few nice bass on my bush hooks using shiners for bait which is legal. A bass will eat a shiner before he would eat a big bream.
> 
> I thought writing my local representatives would help get me a logical answer to why we can't use a bream for bait. All they did was pass the hat.
> 
> He did talk about not releasing a flathead back into the river after being caught. He said there are numerous tournaments in the panhandle and the fish that were caught could feed many needy people if they weren't released. He talked about how a 10# female will lay a million eggs and how we need to remove as many of these from the rivers as possible. I told him I would be glad to do my part if I could use their favorite food for bait.


Plenty of striper are caught on bush hooks- most are on bream by outlaws and yes I know a few. Why is no one complaining about stripe bass? There not native but yet protected?? Don't think a big striper is just a big eating machine??


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## Riverlover (Mar 5, 2016)

Try'n Hard said:


> I agree but most laws/rules that are made involving fishing and hunting are either because of someone abusing the resource or someone wanting to manipulate the resource for personal gain. Think about it


I use resources for personal gain (food on the table). Where I go however, only a few in my community go due to harsh accessibility. I too invest too much in bush hooks but why take them when using the same spot repeatedly and the only others (maybe five people) using the area are known to you personally. Many of the laws employed by FWC are specifically designed to ensure a revenue flow from sportsman. However, I care not for the points on a buck or the specific date. Nor do I care for fancy padded gloves so I can post to freakbook from my stand as if anyone actually cares what im doing at that particular moment. Furthermore, I have no need for the latest greatest $1,000 bow, my 90's Matthews provides just fine. So I guess im not a "sportsman" at all as I wouldn't know how to operate a fishfinder if you gave me one.
My point being, I stay in my little area as I know it and know what works for me. So to each his own.
I do agree that leaving hooks in areas where folks frequent is dumb. Those have to be either folks with enough money to burn a wet mule or folks who don't really fish, just trying their hand. 
I suppose some would say im an outlaw or river raper (whatever that is) but my daddy says fishing was never the same when the flatheads took hold. FWC says Escambia River has no stable bass population cause of flatheads. All I know for a fact is that my family eats something off the river three to for days a week year round and I thank the Father for it.


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## CatHunter (Dec 31, 2008)

Riverlover said:


> I use resources for personal gain (food on the table). Where I go however, only a few in my community go due to harsh accessibility. I too invest too much in bush hooks but why take them when using the same spot repeatedly and the only others (maybe five people) using the area are known to you personally. Many of the laws employed by FWC are specifically designed to ensure a revenue flow from sportsman. However, I care not for the points on a buck or the specific date. Nor do I care for fancy padded gloves so I can post to freakbook from my stand as if anyone actually cares what im doing at that particular moment. Furthermore, I have no need for the latest greatest $1,000 bow, my 90's Matthews provides just fine. So I guess im not a "sportsman" at all as I wouldn't know how to operate a fishfinder if you gave me one.
> My point being, I stay in my little area as I know it and know what works for me. So to each his own.
> I do agree that leaving hooks in areas where folks frequent is dumb. Those have to be either folks with enough money to burn a wet mule or folks who don't really fish, just trying their hand.
> I suppose some would say im an outlaw or river raper (whatever that is) but my daddy says fishing was never the same when the flatheads took hold. FWC says Escambia River has no stable bass population cause of flatheads. All I know for a fact is that my family eats something off the river three to for days a week year round and I thank the Father for it.



Iv been catching monster Shell Crackers and bluegills bigger than your hand by the well fulls on Escambia. And Bass, yea if you cant catch a bass on Escambia or a blue gill its not the flatheads its your fishing skills. Just saying its loaded with them. 

And your dad was right. Escambia was not the same. The first 15 years of the flathead invasion was brutal. Flatheads devastated the unsuspecting population of local fish, they just weren't ready for this new predator as explained in my writings.

However-After so many generation of the relentless slaughter the local fish adapted and began to learn to evade the flatheads. At about the 20 year mark the river rebounds and they rebound in a big way. The fish especially sunfish grow larger than ever before like we are seeing on Escambia today.

I know I don't make many post on here about catching Ditch Pickles (Bass) or sunfish but let me tell you, I catch more than I could ever want on Escambia today. 

Today the fishing on Escambia will be as good as its been in the last 30 years. Now get out there and catch some fish Escambia is alive and thriving.


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## gastonfish (Mar 24, 2012)

Riverlover said:


> I use resources for personal gain (food on the table). Where I go however, only a few in my community go due to harsh accessibility. I too invest too much in bush hooks but why take them when using the same spot repeatedly and the only others (maybe five people) using the area are known to you personally. Many of the laws employed by FWC are specifically designed to ensure a revenue flow from sportsman. However, I care not for the points on a buck or the specific date. Nor do I care for fancy padded gloves so I can post to freakbook from my stand as if anyone actually cares what im doing at that particular moment. Furthermore, I have no need for the latest greatest $1,000 bow, my 90's Matthews provides just fine. So I guess im not a "sportsman" at all as I wouldn't know how to operate a fishfinder if you gave me one.
> My point being, I stay in my little area as I know it and know what works for me. So to each his own.
> I do agree that leaving hooks in areas where folks frequent is dumb. Those have to be either folks with enough money to burn a wet mule or folks who don't really fish, just trying their hand.
> I suppose some would say im an outlaw or river raper (whatever that is) but my daddy says fishing was never the same when the flatheads took hold. FWC says Escambia River has no stable bass population cause of flatheads. All I know for a fact is that my family eats something off the river three to for days a week year round and I thank the Father for it.


Leaving you set hooks out is like putting up 50 ladder stands and claiming every spot as yours. It just good sportsmanship to take them up after use. If there not properly marked you may not need to worry about it very long


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## Riverlover (Mar 5, 2016)

CatHunter said:


> Iv been catching monster Shell Crackers and bluegills bigger than your hand by the well fulls on Escambia. And Bass, yea if you cant catch a bass on Escambia or a blue gill its not the flatheads its your fishing skills. Just saying its loaded with them.
> 
> And your dad was right. Escambia was not the same. The first 15 years of the flathead invasion was brutal. Flatheads devastated the unsuspecting population of local fish, they just weren't ready for this new predator as explained in my writings.
> 
> ...


No problem with my fishing. Can catch my limit in a couple hours on a good day. Just saying what was told to me about flatheads. Of course Daddy don't fish anymore (least not on earth) and FWC told me that doing one of those electro surveys up by Cotton Lake boat ramp.Not really a bass fisherman. Bream and Cats are my thing. While I can't match you in quality, I surely can in quantity.
At any rate, the river is what it is. I'm fine with the changes of nature, it's man that gets to me.


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## Riverlover (Mar 5, 2016)

gastonfish said:


> Leaving you set hooks out is like putting up 50 ladder stands and claiming every spot as yours. It just good sportsmanship to take them up after use. If there not properly marked you may not need to worry about it very long


You must have missed the part where I said maybe 5 people (all personally known) access this portion of river.
And I wouldn't worry about it anyway. As much as possible, I try not to let others actions dictate my own. Besides, ive only seen or heard of FWC being in my area twice in three years, both when water 5' above normal. This due to the accessibility and lack of people to ticket cause rest assured its not about helping wildlife in many instances.


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## CatHunter (Dec 31, 2008)

Riverlover said:


> You must have missed the part where I said maybe 5 people (all personally known) access this portion of river.
> And I wouldn't worry about it anyway. As much as possible, I try not to let others actions dictate my own. Besides, ive only seen or heard of FWC being in my area twice in three years, both when water 5' above normal. This due to the accessibility and lack of people to ticket cause rest assured its not about helping wildlife in many instances.


You must fish North of hwy 4.


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## simpleman (Oct 20, 2007)

CatHunter said:


> You must fish North of hwy 4.


I hope not if 5 people tie lines on every damn tree up sure would hate to see any more I'm on that section of river more than most and its the wild west to few wardens to make a dent and everyone up there knows it.


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