# Bore cleaning



## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

So, I am curious as to how meticulous some are with bore maintenance. I am a Hoppes #9 and sweets guy. Couple wet patches of Hoppes, 10 strokes both ways with a brass brush, couple wet Hoppes patches followed by dry patches until almost clean. Now is when I wet a patch with sweets copper solvent followed by 10 brushes both ways with a nylon bore brush. Then I run a dry patch or two for the gunk. Now I run two more wet Hoppes patches to remove any remnants of the sweets and then dry patch until the patch comes out white. 

So there's my OCD bore cleaning, are you more or less detailed with yours? Just wondering cuz everyone has their own method and there is no one way to do it.


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## bama99 (Dec 20, 2009)

I spray some solvent down the chamber and let "soak" while resting vertically for a few minutes. I then run a bore snake through a couple of times. Put some gun oil on the tail end of the bore snake for one last pass and that's it for me.


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## FrankwT (Jul 25, 2010)

sniperpeeps said:


> So, I am curious as to how meticulous some are with bore maintenance. I am a Hoppes #9 and sweets guy. Couple wet patches of Hoppes, 10 strokes both ways with a brass brush, couple wet Hoppes patches followed by dry patches until almost clean. Now is when I wet a patch with sweets copper solvent followed by 10 brushes both ways with a nylon bore brush. Then I run a dry patch or two for the gunk. Now I run two more wet Hoppes patches to remove any remnants of the sweets and then dry patch until the patch comes out white.
> 
> So there's my OCD bore cleaning, are you more or less detailed with yours? Just wondering cuz everyone has their own method and there is no one way to do it.



I clean my guns when they are taken into the field and or fired, I am not nearly as OCD as you, afraid you are wearing your barrel out prematurely! I do not believe I did that even in Vietnam...lol but I congratulate you on the OCD awareness...lol


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## HisName (Nov 29, 2009)

only use an Otis Pull through from the breach forward . wet patch and sit 5 min / dry patch , brush 5 times , wet patch , sit 5 min / dry patch until clean.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

I should add, thats every 100 rds


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## Splittine (Nov 24, 2007)

I clean it till the copper is out. Most of the time it's fairly easy if you break in a barrel the correct way. Most people run a patch through it and look down the bore and think its clean. I only use nylon brushes and always use a bore guide. I like Butchs bore shine, 50 BMG, Sweets, etc. mainly Butches. Most people don't even know how to break a barrel in, not really necessary on hunting rifles but it becomes habit.


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## scubapro (Nov 27, 2010)

I can tell by reading some of these comments - that I haven't "broken-in" my rifle barrels properly...

Good information for if/when I get a new long distance precision rifle.


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## Emerald Ghost (Mar 11, 2008)

I must be terrible gun at rifling maintenance .


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

Splittine said:


> Most people don't even know how to break a barrel in, not really necessary on hunting rifles but it becomes habit.


Ah, barrel break in brings back memories of many hours on Maertens range. When we got 40 new M24's in at the schoolhouse I was hating barrel break in lol. When you properly break in a bore and it gets nice and polished it comes clean so much easier, not to mention extending barrel life.


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## aaronious45 (Dec 15, 2011)

I clean after every other shooting. I break the gun down completely, wash everything in hot soapy (dawn) water, dry, heavily oil, pat dry, reassemble

I don't put a lot of rounds through when I shoot though


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## Jason (Oct 2, 2007)

Cleaning my guns is like cleaning a deer.....most folks hate to do it, but it's a calming peace fer me and I LOVE IT!!! Once again I'll push Strike Hold!!! Adam, you may be familiar w/ it since it was developed fer the military.....


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

Strike hold is great, my favorite solvent for cleaning pistols and AR's and for keeping my boat motor corrosion free


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## merkinman (Feb 15, 2012)

Just google TUBB 2000, and stop the insanity


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## Az-Vic (Jan 7, 2012)

I confess; Im lazy, and because Im lazy, I found the easiest method of bore cleaning on the planet and fortunately it has been the best Ive found. A product called Wiipeout, a foaming bore cleaner that everbody is stockingnow. Patience is the name of the game,and if your lazy it's even easier. Foam bore, let sit over night then swab out,clean,finished,done....good stuff.


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## kaferhaus (Oct 8, 2009)

"wipe out" seldom gets a bore clean with one application. I push a solvent soaked patch through the bore. Let it sit a few minutes, put solvent on a NYLON brush, run it back and forth 10 strokes, wet patch, 2 dry patches then a loose patch soaked in "patch out", go away for 20 minutes, dry patch.... if I see dark blue then wet patch and wait again.

I'm usually cleaning 3-4 rifles at the same time so it's not that bad.

My match rifles, clean up in about 5-10 minutes as they don't really copper foul at all.

The hunting rifles all copper foul to some degree and are a pita to clean.... fortunately they don't get shot much


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## merkinman (Feb 15, 2012)

Dudes you have all sucomed to the BS,Remember LARD in our little cap guns. ONLY pull from chamber down.


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## merkinman (Feb 15, 2012)

*Pull Your Head Out*

Dealing with .556 use 1/8 cotton rope dipped in brake fluid (use mono leader) from chamber down. Remember D.O.T 3 is corrosive, then wash with Brake parts cleaner, then lube as if you wanted to have _ex with it.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

merkinman said:


> Dudes you have all sucomed to the BS,Remember LARD in our little cap guns. ONLY pull from chamber down.


That's actually not true, as long as you don't change directions while the brush is inside the chamber it's fine to scrub both ways. Use a bore guide and a cleaning rod and scrub. I have seen people painstakingly remove the brush at the muzzle and then reattach it and push it through the same way....not my method to be sure.


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## TheCarver (May 5, 2011)

Give the break in procedures please, an I guess proper cleaning with comercial products. I plan on buying my son a rifle an do these things, then put it away till he is old enough to handle the rifle himself. ,Hand gun as well, Thanks ole Carver


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## HisName (Nov 29, 2009)

sniperpeeps said:


> Ah, barrel break in brings back memories of many hours on Maertens range. When we got 40 new M24's in at the schoolhouse I was hating barrel break in lol. When you properly break in a bore and it gets nice and polished it comes clean so much easier, not to mention extending barrel life.


 
Breaking in a barrel is a lot easier with the Otis System.
no disassembly needed . 1st used it with my LR308 AP4 and it was so easy to just run it down the barrel from the breach without even removing the bolt.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

HisName said:


> Breaking in a barrel is a lot easier with the Otis System.
> no disassembly needed . 1st used it with my LR308 AP4 and it was so easy to just run it down the barrel from the breach without even removing the bolt.



OTIS makes the best field cleaning kit hands down


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## tyler0421 (Jan 10, 2008)

Is there any scent free gun cleaning kits?


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## wyld3man (Oct 4, 2011)

sniperpeeps said:


> Ah, barrel break in brings back memories of many hours on Maertens range. When we got 40 new M24's in at the schoolhouse I was hating barrel break in lol. When you properly break in a bore and it gets nice and polished it comes clean so much easier, not to mention extending barrel life.


 Remington is off loading 2000 M24's to military, former military and LEO's, wish I could talk the wifey into letting me get one. I first read it in Army Times 2 months ago. I run a snake with a few drops of CLP on it few times after light use and then I will run a brass brush through 2 times followed by the snake after heavy use. I just started to use TW25 as a lube for the moving parts the past couple months on various guns and am only using CLP as a cleaner. I use to use CLP as a do-all and so far I am happy with the change up.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...f-2000-ex-military-m24-sniper-rifles-at-shot/


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

wyld3man said:


> Remington is off loading 2000 M24's to military, former military and LEO's, wish I could talk the wifey into letting me get one. I first read it in Army Times 2 months ago. I run a snake with a few drops of CLP on it few times after light use and then I will run a brass brush through 2 times followed by the snake after heavy use. I just started to use TW25 as a lube for the moving parts the past couple months on various guns and am only using CLP as a cleaner. I use to use CLP as a do-all and so far I am happy with the change up.
> 
> http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...f-2000-ex-military-m24-sniper-rifles-at-shot/



Yep I imagine more and more of those M24's will start showing up now that they are being phased out by the m110 and the m2010. I have to say I'm not a big fan of the HS precision stock on them but they are great rifles over all. I highly recommend using a powder solvent of some sorts on your bore and not clp. CLP is not designed for bore cleaning, it is more of an all around lubricant.


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## bama99 (Dec 20, 2009)

I found this article pretty interesting:

http://www.americanrifleman.org/Webcontent/pdf/2009-10/20091015104116-cleanbarrel.pdf


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

bama99 said:


> I found this article pretty interesting:
> 
> http://www.americanrifleman.org/Webcontent/pdf/2009-10/20091015104116-cleanbarrel.pdf


He may be right, or not. I know one thing and it's the way I was taught and it is the way I will stick with. I know that with the lake city we were shooting through the m24's, we had noticeable loss of accuracy after 50 or so rounds. Note that the author of that article cites custom made barrels and clean burning powder as one of the reason's for his opinion. Guess if your shooting all primo stuff you may be good. One things for sure, breaking in a barrel doesn't hurt anything.


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## IM4MOPAR (Mar 10, 2011)

Just picked up a tikka 25-06, stainless barrel. what would be a breakin procedure for this? hunting purposes. not a great amount of shooting.


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## bama99 (Dec 20, 2009)

sniperpeeps said:


> He may be right, or not. I know one thing and it's the way I was taught and it is the way I will stick with. I know that with the lake city we were shooting through the m24's, we had noticeable loss of accuracy after 50 or so rounds. Note that the author of that article cites custom made barrels and clean burning powder as one of the reason's for his opinion. Guess if your shooting all primo stuff you may be good. One things for sure, breaking in a barrel doesn't hurt anything.


 I don't know much of anything about precision long range shooting. What kind of differences in accuracy do you see between a "properly" broken in barrel and one not broken in? I'm guessing the average shooter/hunter would never notice a difference. There seems to be so many different opinions on what methods to use it makes my head hurt. I've never personally broken in a barrel other than shooting it and the normal cleaning afterwards. I figure if it's grouping under an inch at 100 yards what's the point. But I'm not a sniper or benchrest competition shooter either. I found it interesting that the long range competition shooters go so many rounds between cleaning because they say they are more accurate with a fouled barrel at long ranges.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

bama99 said:


> I don't know much of anything about precision long range shooting. What kind of differences in accuracy do you see between a "properly" broken in barrel and one not broken in? I'm guessing the average shooter/hunter would never notice a difference. There seems to be so many different opinions on what methods to use it makes my head hurt. I've never personally broken in a barrel other than shooting it and the normal cleaning afterwards. I figure if it's grouping under an inch at 100 yards what's the point. But I'm not a sniper or benchrest competition shooter either. I found it interesting that the long range competition shooters go so many rounds between cleaning because they say they are more accurate with a fouled barrel at long ranges.


Barrel break in will not effect the accuracy of the rifle one way or another. The whole idea is that is helps put a polish on the inside of the bore. This makes it easier to clean and helps the barrels last longer. This is what I have heard from a lot of people, but I have also heard from many that it's not important. When I shot in competitions we always fouled our barrels, which usually just meant leaving them dirty after zero/confirm. When you hear the term "cold bore" shot it means the first shot fired out of a rifle that has a clean barrel. This shot often deviates from where the following rounds will group. Some rifles even fire 2 rounds that will impact off from the following groups. After you fire a couple of rounds and the bore gets fouled, you will get more consistent groups. I really don't know for sure why that is, I have never really heard a good answer on it but it works. When I worked at the sniper school at benning we had some civilian instructors who were former AMU shooters and active benchrest shooters. They taught this same method of breaking in barrels as well as shooting fouled barrels and I trust what they had to say about it.


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## FrankwT (Jul 25, 2010)

So Sniper, how does a Sniper foul his barrel before a kill shot, or does he shoot a cold barrel and hope he does not need the better group with a fouled barrel??


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## Az-Vic (Jan 7, 2012)

here's what Gale McMillan had to say about break in....makes perfect sense

It all got started when a barrel maker that I know started putting break-in instructions in the box with each barrel he shipped a few years ago. I asked him how he figured it would help and his reply was if they shoot 100 rounds breaking in this barrel that's total life is 3000 rounds and I make 1000 barrels a year just figure how many more barrels I will get to make. He had a point; it definately will shorten the barrel life. I have been a barrel maker a fair amount of time and my barrels have set and reset benchrest world records so many times I quit keeping track (at one time they held 7 at one time) along with High Power, Silhouette, Smallbore national and world records and my instructions were to clean as often as possible preferably every 10 rounds. I inspect every barrel taken off and every new barrel before it is shipped with a bore scope and I will tell you all that I see far more barrels ruined by cleaning rods than I see worn out from normal wear and tear. I am even reading about people recommending breaking-in pistols. As if it will help their shooting ability or the guns'. More from Gale McMillan: http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/Barrel_BreakIn.asp


Hart barrel company advises against break in, at least on their barrels too, so the jury is out. I agree you probably won't hurt your barrel breaking it in, so ,no harm, no foul I suppose?


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

FrankwT said:


> So Sniper, how does a Sniper foul his barrel before a kill shot, or does he shoot a cold barrel and hope he does not need the better group with a fouled barrel??


On missions we would always zero/confirm before missions and leave the barrels dirty. Also, cold bore shots are something that snipers keep in their data book. Everytime we went to the range, we fired a cold bore from whatever range we started shooting from. This let us have data on the cold bore in case we didn't have a chance to fire before mission.


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## Splittine (Nov 24, 2007)

How many world records has McMillan barrel set in the last year compared to Krieger and even Brux in the benchrest world? My money is on Krieger and Brux. Look at there break in precedures. I'm not saying its the bible but I do know one thing it makes cleaning up a barrel a hell of a lot easier at the end of the day.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

The bottom line about barrel break in is that there are a lot of varying opinions on it. However, there is no hard data to look at and clearly say for sure that barrel break in is or is not worthwhile. I would recommend following the manufacturers guidance for your individual rifle.


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## wyld3man (Oct 4, 2011)

It seems that everyone has a different method to break in barrels and clean a bore (or not to clean). I was curious so I asked a few of my buddies around here and each one has a different technique. In the end if your rifle holds a good shot group and is lasting the amount of rounds the manufacture says it should you are good to go. I usually follow what the manufacture says as far as break in. We received a few MK17's a while back and had some guys run us through some training on them. The two things they made sure we did was clean up all the cosmalene and run a bore snake through the barrels after 10 rounds. That is for an assault rifle though so take it for what its worth.


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## wyld3man (Oct 4, 2011)

sniperpeeps said:


> Yep I imagine more and more of those M24's will start showing up now that they are being phased out by the m110 and the m2010. I have to say I'm not a big fan of the HS precision stock on them but they are great rifles over all. I highly recommend using a powder solvent of some sorts on your bore and not clp. CLP is not designed for bore cleaning, it is more of an all around lubricant.


They tried to get us to turn them in when we got the 110's. Everyone here took that as a recommendation and never went to do it:no:. We still have them and it has been more than a year.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

wyld3man said:


> They tried to get us to turn them in when we got the 110's. Everyone here took that as a recommendation and never went to do it:no:. We still have them and it has been more than a year.


Hang on to them for sure! Did you guys not get the mk13's or m2010 yet? IMO the m110 is a POS, the Army paid way to much for a glorified ar-10....doesn't even have a forward assist WTF?


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## wyld3man (Oct 4, 2011)

We got the Mk13 a little while after the 110's. We use to have a couple SR25's but they took those as soon as we got the 110's. Some were able to keep them by playing stupid just like with the M24's. I am not overly impressed with the 110's either. Wish we could trade them in for a couple LaRue OBR's.


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## FrankwT (Jul 25, 2010)

sniperpeeps said:


> On missions we would always zero/confirm before missions and leave the barrels dirty. Also, cold bore shots are something that snipers keep in their data book. Everytime we went to the range, we fired a cold bore from whatever range we started shooting from. This let us have data on the cold bore in case we didn't have a chance to fire before mission.



Thanks sniper, so what did the data reveal in your data book compared to a dirty bore?? So me coming home and cleaning my barrel after shooting an animal instead of leaving it fouled for 3 mos is a good or bad thing? I am sighted in with a dirty bore.


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## BOGIA (Oct 7, 2007)

im4mopar.loan me that o6 for a year and ill break it for ya!


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

FrankwT said:


> Thanks sniper, so what did the data reveal in your data book compared to a dirty bore?? So me coming home and cleaning my barrel after shooting an animal instead of leaving it fouled for 3 mos is a good or bad thing? I am sighted in with a dirty bore.



Every rifle had different cold bore deviation. If I remember right, our M24 was about a minute low and right, but some rifles have minimal cold bore deviation. I would for sure clean your hunting rifle when you are done with it and not leave it fouled for 3 months. Especially if you shoot ammo with potentially corrosive primers. The most cold bore deviation I have seen out of any of our sniper rifles was about 2 moa (2 inches) at 100 meters. Unless you plan on making some precision long range shots with your hunting rifle, you shouldn't worry to much about the cold bore data, IMO.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

wyld3man said:


> We got the Mk13 a little while after the 110's. We use to have a couple SR25's but they took those as soon as we got the 110's. Some were able to keep them by playing stupid just like with the M24's. I am not overly impressed with the 110's either. Wish we could trade them in for a couple LaRue OBR's.


Thought you might enjoy this pic, happened at a comp at Ft. Bragg. During a stress shoot and the guy must have hit his muzzle in the mud. He was lucky he didn't get seriously hurt. Sorry its blurry, crappy cell pic.


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## kaferhaus (Oct 8, 2009)

> The most cold bore deviation I have seen out of any of our sniper rifles was about 2 moa (2 inches) at 100 meters.


Wow! The worst shooting rifle I ever owned didn't have near 2MOA of cold and clean bore deviation.... Most of my match rifles have less than .25" "cold and clean" bore deviation.

And every rifle is different. For a hunting rig it's easy enough to discover where it puts the first shot out of a cold, clean bore... that's the only shot you should have to worry about, so keep your rifle clean and don't worry with it...

Having owned several hundred rifles, I've yet to own one that shot better "fouled" than "clean" I've shot both short (100-300yds) and long (600-1000yds) bench rest for years... short range matches we clean between every string as there's plenty of time to do so. The ONLY reason we don't clean between strings on LR is you have no time. Once your relay is finished you have to remove all your gear and immediately go pull targets for the next relay.

As to corrosive primers... unless you're buying very, very old surplus ammo, the chances of finding corrosive ammo is about zero.

The "clean or don't clean" and "what's the best way to clean" debates are as old as shooting. The average hunter will never shoot his rifle enough to worry about wearing it out from improper cleaning techniques because he'll likely only clean it less than 20-30 times in his lifetime...

Stay away from steel cleaning rods and ammonia based cleaners and even a moron can get one clean without tearing it up prematurely.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

kaferhaus said:


> Wow! The worst shooting rifle I ever owned didn't have near 2MOA of cold and clean bore deviation.... Most of my match rifles have less than .25" "cold and clean" bore deviation.


Believe it or not, some of the M24's would come straight from Remington with more than 1 MOA of cold bore deviation, it wasn't uncommon. The M110's were even worse.




kaferhaus said:


> As to corrosive primers... unless you're buying very, very old surplus ammo, the chances of finding corrosive ammo is about zero.


We were forced to shoot some of the ancient .50 AP from the late 1940's at the school house. Stuff came in a green can with a sardine top. Those rounds would turn the muzzle breaks green if you didn't immediately clean the 107's.

Yall, I would definitely listen to what Kafer has to say. 90% of my experience is with government issue stuff like M24's, M110's, M107's etc. While it sounds cool, it's really not top notch equipment like a barrel that a benchrest shooter shoots. We had techniques that worked for the type of rifles and equipment that we used. While I know my stuff in regards to military issue rifles, mission planning, tactics, and shooting I won't pretend that I am a gunsmith or a rifle expert that knows anything near what Kafer and other guys who shoot matches all the time know.


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## wyld3man (Oct 4, 2011)

sniperpeeps said:


> Thought you might enjoy this pic, happened at a comp at Ft. Bragg. During a stress shoot and the guy must have hit his muzzle in the mud. He was lucky he didn't get seriously hurt. Sorry its blurry, crappy cell pic.


Damn, that's crazy. Glad he was not hurt that bad. All this long gun stuff is fairly new to me. I work with a few qualified guys that have been cross training me as time permits. I have a feeling that I will be headed to the school back at bragg once we return, should be a good learning experience and very helpful as I am supposed to know all guns and not just assault rifles, machine guns and mortars.


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## sniperpeeps (Mar 5, 2011)

wyld3man said:


> Damn, that's crazy. Glad he was not hurt that bad. All this long gun stuff is fairly new to me. I work with a few qualified guys that have been cross training me as time permits. I have a feeling that I will be headed to the school back at bragg once we return, should be a good learning experience.



Range 37 is AWESOME!


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## wyld3man (Oct 4, 2011)

sniperpeeps said:


> Range 37 is AWESOME!


Yeah it is, uncle sam put a little cash into that one. I have not had the chance to shoot there as I only spent a few months at bragg when I finished the course before headed to FL. I did spend some time at range 65 though, its nice because it is ran by 3rd now and the only interaction we would have with range control was a phone call to tell them we were done for the day.


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