# Beer can reef?



## Nitzey (Oct 9, 2007)

In the Gulf, I sink my beer cans and soda bottles thinking that they are relatively clean and add to the reef, where ever I am. However, my wife disapproves of this and some of the people who fish with me. What do others think? I figure if it is relatively clean, it will add to the structure and barnacles, etc. will grow on it.


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## hjorgan (Sep 30, 2007)

It's legal to dump anything but plastic at 9 miles plus. I don't think it hurts anything. Opinions vary.


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## Randy M (Jul 8, 2012)

More than enough of that crap out there, plain and simple you are littering!

Here's a slide show of dead birds from ingesting plastic in one of the most remote places in the ocean.......Midway Atoll.
http://animal.discovery.com/birds/ocean-gyre-birds/albatross-ocean-gyre-birds-pictures.html


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## Smarty (Nov 23, 2008)

Randy M said:


> More than enough of that crap out there, plain and simple you are littering!


 +1 I've caught my share of those little reefs. The only purpose it served was to give a small crab or two a place to hide and to dull my hooks. That and to help me burn a few calories putting the damn thing in a garbage can where it should have gone to begin with.


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## saku39 (May 11, 2010)

seriously? plastic is NEVER ok in the water

never biodegrates, leaches sh*t into the water

aluminum is another non-healthy substance, when broken down can cause cancer

if it aint steel or organic i dont put it in the water


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## swander (Dec 1, 2007)

You should see all the cans and bottles on the reefs!! I think it sucks and can guarantee you that a can or bottle sitting in the sand 20 ft from the reef looks like crap and does absolutely nothing for the reef!! Oh, you should see the trash on the "Natural" bottom at Greens Hole! Cans and bottles look great out there! One time I will leave my speargun in the boat and just video the trash! 

Just my opinion!!


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## knot @ Work (Apr 18, 2012)

That is trash and does not help at all.

You are misguided in thinking it helps the reefs.

Please take all your cans and trash with you back to shore...


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## islandmanmitch (Jun 17, 2012)

Trash is trash. Keep it in the boat.


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

yea lets pull up all that unnatural crap that doesnt belong down there. how about start with the "o", then army tanks, or those pesky concrete pyramids. have you ever seen a pile of bridge rubble, how disgusting.

i have a reef called the bud 55 and wish people would stop fishing it, especially bonta dan.


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## Telum Pisces (Sep 27, 2007)

Small stuff will not go straight down number one. If there is a current at all, it will not land on the reef. Number two, it's not providing any habitat when it get's blown off the reef with a slight current or small storm. There are reasons why there are weight and thickness rules for reefs that are permited and sunk. 

Please don't throw your beer cans and bottles over. As a Diver, I hate seeing all that crap everywhere. I have seen beer cans rolling past me like a tubble weed in the current going to be burried in the sand who knows where off the reef.


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## Nitzey (Oct 9, 2007)

No way do I put plastic into the Gulf. Only aluminum cans and glass bottles, properly sunk. Aluminum is not toxic; it is the third most prevalent element in the Earth. Silicon (major component of glass) and oxygen being the most prevalent elements. In my experience solid objects start to grow barnacles within a few days. Eventually other things (corals for example) build on any solid object.


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## Randy M (Jul 8, 2012)

Well, if you won't listen to your own wife I guess you won't listen to anyone here. What exactly was the point in your original question?


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## MillerTime (Jul 6, 2011)

Solid objects do grow stuff on them but small stuff like that is not going to stay still. To me thats just being lazy and not wanting to properly throw your trash away. Glass bottles especially if they break could actually hurt someone.


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

one mans trash is another mans reef

one beer bottle is trash, 5000 beer bottles is a reef


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## Smarty (Nov 23, 2008)

nextstep said:


> one mans trash is another mans reef
> 
> one beer bottle is trash, 5000 beer bottles is a reef


 Or broken glass all over the beach after a major storm front comes through :thumbdown:


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_glass


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## MillerTime (Jul 6, 2011)

Yes eventually it will round off but not right away. Also 5000 beer bottles are not going to just collect and make a reef.


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## Nitzey (Oct 9, 2007)

Randy M said:


> Well, if you won't listen to your own wife I guess you won't listen to anyone here. What exactly was the point in your original question?


I have found it a lot better to listen to my wife than to contradict her. However, why not do some good with solid objects rather than send them to a land fill where they are of no benefit to anyone? Also, we are not talking about close to the beach.


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## Randy M (Jul 8, 2012)

Nitzey said:


> I have found it a lot better to listen to my wife than to contradict her. However, why not do some good with solid objects rather than send them to a land fill where they are of no benefit to anyone? Also, we are not talking about close to the beach.


So it's better to put that crap in the ocean than in a landfill? Well then heck, let's take all the bottles and cans that would go to a landfill and dump them at sea, if what you are doing is a good thing then just think how much good all that garbage would be!


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=sea+...&w=550&h=365&ei=E_wVUNmeDOeC6QG4poHgBQ&zoom=1


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## welldoya (Oct 5, 2007)

Don't throw them overboard and don't put them in the garbage. Drop them by a recycle dumpster. I keep two plastic garbage cans in my garage - one for paper and cardboard and one for bottles and cans. About every two weeks, I drop them by the recycle dumpster. It's not hard and doesn't take long.


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## Smarty (Nov 23, 2008)

nextstep said:


> http://www.google.com/imgres?q=sea+...&w=550&h=365&ei=E_wVUNmeDOeC6QG4poHgBQ&zoom=1


 Indonesia, enough said :no:


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## Smarty (Nov 23, 2008)

*Nice fishing*



Smarty said:


> Indonesia, enough said :no:


 Very nice!


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

http://www.bluemarlindive.com/gili-islands-lombok-indonesia-pictures.html


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

http://www.sportdiver.com/photos/dive-photo-paradise-indonesias-lembeh-and-raja-ampat-gallery

enough said?


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## FelixH (Sep 28, 2007)

Nitzey said:


> However, why not do some good with solid objects rather than send them to a land fill where they are of no benefit to anyone?


Try recycling... then there's no question of "am I doing wrong."
If you have to ask, then yeah, there's probably something wrong with what you're doing.


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## baldona523 (Mar 2, 2008)

If I walk 9 miles back into the woods and start dropping cans and bottles everywhere is that littering? I don't see how 9 miles off shore is any different than 9 miles into the woods.


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

!


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## Splittine (Nov 24, 2007)

If you wouldn't throw that shit out in your front yard don't throw it in our gulf.


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## swander (Dec 1, 2007)

Splittine said:


> If you wouldn't throw that shit out in your front yard don't throw it in our gulf.


 
+1 :thumbsup:


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## jasoncooperpcola (Jan 2, 2008)

What does the peel paper on the back of your boat registration say?


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## Magic Mike (Jun 30, 2009)

This tread took me by surprise... I have never heard such a thing. It's disturbing that people actually do this thinking they're helping the environment... what kind of screwed up logic are you working with man? Put your bottles in the recycle bin.


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## Orion45 (Jun 26, 2008)

Splittine said:


> If you wouldn't throw that shit out in your front yard don't throw it in our gulf.


The problem is that some people actually do. :thumbdown:

The correct answer seems like a no brainer to me.....keep all trash in the boat and bring it back with you.


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## Orion45 (Jun 26, 2008)

hjorgan said:


> It's legal to dump anything but plastic at 9 miles plus. I don't think it hurts anything. Opinions vary.


It might be legal but it looks like shit to a diver.


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## shipoke (Jul 11, 2008)

I allways figured the reason people throw empty alcholic containers overboard or out the window, is to get rid of the evidence.
Shipoke


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## capt'n slim (Feb 8, 2008)

of all the dumb things i have heard today this one may just be the dumbest. General public never cease to amaze me.


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## 60hertz (Oct 1, 2007)

Not only should you bring things back and place them in recycling centers, you should probably leave the glass containers on land. 

In Santa Rosa county you can even be fined for having glass containers on a waterway.


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## flukedaddy (Apr 11, 2009)

capt'n slim said:


> of all the dumb things i have heard today this one may just be the dumbest. General public never cease to amaze me.


+1
I always pick up all I see that idots let fly outta their boat. 

http://www.cityoforangebeach.com/pages_2007/pdfs/wildlife/2009/TRASH_IN_THE_GULF.pdf

50 yrs for aluminum can
500 yrs for plastic bottle 
1,000,000 yrs for Glass that is a million years good grief man that is sick
the gulf needs to puke all this stuff on your home and return the favor... maybe something good will come of it. lol


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## welldoya (Oct 5, 2007)

Back in the 60s my parents and I used to go on overnight trips on head boats out of Panama City. We went out a pretty good ways - usually left the dock at 1:00 am and started fishing at 6:00 am. Usually fished till 1:00 or 2:00 pm and back at the dock by 6:00.
On the way back in the deck hands would take all the garbage cans to the stern and dump them overboard. I was only 10 or 12 at the time and the sight of all that garbage floating made me sick. 
Hopefully they don't still do that.


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## jasoncooperpcola (Jan 2, 2008)

Something else to think about. It does not take much air for a can to float just below the surface. If a mackeral missle hit that wot it would bust a hole in the hull.


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## Magic Mike (Jun 30, 2009)

capt'n slim said:


> of all the dumb things i have heard today this one may just be the dumbest. General public never cease to amaze me.


+1:thumbsup:


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## Play'N Hooky Too (Sep 29, 2007)

Magic Mike said:


> +1:thumbsup:


 +10
If you can carry it out there full why can't you carry it back empty? Throw that crap in your own yard.


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## k-p (Oct 7, 2009)

We were out earlier this year on one of the out islands of the Bahamas and the amount of pieces of plastic in the water was insane. we couldn't believe how many bits and pieces of plastic was in such a remote location, some of it was like a soup in certain areas. When we go offshore we usually carry nalgene bottles with water because you're not throwing the things away every five minutes and there's not plastic bottles to be floating around everywhere plus its a lot cheaper than buying water.


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

the crap coming out of the exhaust from our boat motors is way worse for the environment than sinking glass bottles 12 miles out. or the oil spill that comes from the demand for petroleum for our suvs or boats. before judging the actions of others maybe we should look in the mirror.


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## EODangler (Apr 7, 2011)

I actually thought the OP was joking when I read his post. 

Unfortunately he wasn't...even worse there are people who support these actions.


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## Play'N Hooky Too (Sep 29, 2007)

nextstep said:


> the crap coming out of the exhaust from our boat motors is way worse for the environment than sinking glass bottles 12 miles out. or the oil spill that comes from the demand for petroleum for our suvs or boats. before judging the actions of others maybe we should look in the mirror.


What about 10 miles out or 5 miles out or 1 mile out. I mean a bottle takes up a lot more space on your boat 12 miles out than it does at three miles right? The exhaust products and oil are biodegradable and won't be washing up on the beach for the next 200 years. But if you want to see how fast the environmental groups start taking your argument seriously and using it to influence policy just keep dumping your trash overboard.


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## Nitzey (Oct 9, 2007)

There have been many reasoned respsonse to the original post, but quite a few lately are just plain virtiolic.

In the original post, I said that I have been sinking clean bottles and cans over reefs where I fish (usually 16+ miles out). My thinking is that these solid objects, although small, provide anchors for benthos creatures, starting with barnacles, and eventually add to the reef. Seems reasonable to me. 

At home, we recycle almost everything. Very little is put into the green garbage can.


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## Chris V (Oct 18, 2007)

Garbage is never ok in the water. Bring it back with you. Be respectful of the millions of others who love the gulf and don't want your trash there. There's zero reasoning for it.

The absolute worse reasoning is the distance rule, stating how far you gave to before you can legally dump trash. It doesn't matter how far you are or whether it is "legal", it is just ethically wrong to throw trash in the water.


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## Telum Pisces (Sep 27, 2007)

Nitzey said:


> There have been many reasoned respsonse to the original post, but quite a few lately are just plain virtiolic.
> 
> In the original post, I said that I have been sinking clean bottles and cans over reefs where I fish (usually 16+ miles out). My thinking is that these solid objects, although small, provide anchors for benthos creatures, starting with barnacles, and eventually add to the reef. Seems reasonable to me.
> 
> At home, we recycle almost everything. Very little is put into the green garbage can.


Again, as a diver, I ask you not to do this. It's not natural and I don't like looking at garbage anywhere. Much less in a beautiful underwater environment that should be free of garbage. You don't see it after you sink it. I DO!!!!!! There is nothing cool about seeing beer cans or any other garbage for that matter underwater. A glass bottle may sink to the reef. But an aluminum can will probably not land on the reef at all. Even if there is no surface current, there can be current on the bottom or in the middle of the water column that will easily carry that can away from the reef. 

A barnacle covered piece of garbage is still garbage and it looks horrible underwater. 

Your position would mean that it's ok to place cans and bottles on growing trees in the woods. The wood/trunk/limbs will eventually grow around them (years and not the same timeline as growth underwater), but still the same argument. You walk away thinking that you just made that tree better for the environment and gave a bird or insect a home. Yet the next person that comes walking by sees the garbage and wonders what inconsiderate person put that there. 

You don't see it topside. As divers, WE DO!!!!!!!


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## Fishermon (Oct 19, 2007)

"ethics"

just pack your shit and bring it back to your house...don't think you are doing fish a favor. And for those smokers (you know who you are)(some are friends of mine)...put that stinky butt in your pocket and don't throw it over board...it really ruins my day out there when I see shit like that..excuse my words..but it really pisses me off in general when people do stupid 'shit' ...DO NOT litter. period!> beer, soda cans..bottles..are you kidding me?...I admire your reasoning , but i do respcect it at the same time....lol...wow!!!!


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## Getsome (Sep 28, 2007)

Magic Mike said:


> This tread took me by surprise... I have never heard such a thing. It's disturbing that people actually do this thinking they're helping the environment... what kind of screwed up logic are you working with man? Put your bottles in the recycle bin.


 
This^!!^


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## FLbeachbum (Jul 17, 2008)

Bring your own trash back and then some more. No reason to leave trash anywhere.


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## K-man (Oct 18, 2011)

Great thread. If only 1 person who has been throwing over cans and bottles and thinking it is ok reads this and changes their ways, it will be worth the discussion. But hopefully more than 1 will...


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## flukedaddy (Apr 11, 2009)

K-man said:


> Great thread. If only 1 person who has been throwing over cans and bottles and thinking it is ok reads this and changes their ways, it will be worth the discussion. But hopefully more than 1 will...


 WHat he said ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Cmon ... bottles last a million years and if reefs get covered and broke apart during storms whats happening with these bottles.:thumbdown: nice legacy to leave behind for future generations for the next million..:clapping:


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## zulubravo34 (Dec 23, 2010)

I just wanna say as a diver/ spear fisherman I hate what people like you do! It makes the whole area around it look like crap. So hey nextstep, I just looked in the mirror and what I saw is a responsible fisherman who keeps his own trash in his boat and picks up trash that other people leave on the water.... And I bet you got yourself one of them there petroleum usin' machines too don't ya!?! So for one, please stop ruining our oceans, and two... Learn respect for the rest of us boaters/divers/fisherman, and more importantly the ocean and earth.


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

after this discussion some civil, some not so civil or "virtiolic"
this is what i come away with:
i still dont believe glass bottles are harmful to the underwater gulf environment when placed legally outside 12+ miles and are probably beneficial to the "benthos creatures", BUT people (divers) dont want to look at it and i guess i can understand that. for this reason i am thinking about curbing my reefing program. (respect for others)

here are a few facts: 

i have been a cert. diver since 1985, although its been awhile.

we recycle everything we can

while on the water if we see trash floating we go out of our way to pick it
up and have came home with a boat loads before.

we dont allow people to even flip their butts out of our boat.

we have participated in organized ft. mcrae beach clean ups. (it would be nice to see some that were so critical there)

when we leave ft. mcrae we ALWAYS bring home more than we came with.

we are not polluters.

and finally if you are one of the folks being ugly, stop fishing my select 55 reef its been getting a little crowded lately.


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## redeyes (Jan 14, 2008)

Lack of respect
The misguided idiots who think it is ok to throw litter into the gulf have no respect for the environment, their fellow outdoorsmen, the game they fish or hunt, and no respect for their children who will be able to see the fruits of their labor(select 55 reef) for millions of years.
You are uneducated fools... after all... only trash leaves their trash!
I think I speak for the rest of us, please stop littering, thanks.


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## bigrick (Sep 29, 2010)

I agree, the tourist are bad enough. I've thrown litter back at people before in Destin.


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## PompChaser315 (Feb 18, 2011)

Just sounds like laziness to me


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## SHO-NUFF (May 30, 2011)

When I didn't know any better, 
I deployed reefs from unapproved materials not healthy for our Gulf. Old tires, and lots of them. There are places in the gulf that look like an underwater junkyard. 
As far as Beer cans and bottles, I doubt they do any harm, but what good could they do?? It would take thousands of them in one spot to create any type of fish habitat. And no current could be present. 
I always bring home more trash than I take out with me. Fish the tide line, weed line, or "Trash line" and look at all the stuff already floating out there. 
And for the comments about Ft. McRee or Ft. McRae, its disgusting that the place has been trashed so bad over the recent years!!! I doubt there are other places in the world so beautiful and people show such disregard for the place. 
Can't blame it on Tourists either. Most of them don't own a boat. Sadly its the Local's trashing the place.


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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

BRING YOUR TRASH BACK WITH YOU. HOW ABOUT I THROW ALL MY APPLE CORES AND BANANA PEALS IN YOUR FRONT YARD? I'M ADDING TO THE NATURAL FERTILIZER FOR YOUR YARD. 

Gee... what were you thinking?


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## Yakavelli (Mar 17, 2010)

zulubravo34 said:


> I just wanna say as a diver/ spear fisherman I hate what people like you do! It makes the whole area around it look like crap. So hey nextstep, I just looked in the mirror and what I saw is a responsible fisherman who keeps his own trash in his boat and picks up trash that other people leave on the water.... And I bet you got yourself one of them there petroleum usin' machines too don't ya!?! So for one, please stop ruining our oceans, and two... Learn respect for the rest of us boaters/divers/fisherman, and more importantly the ocean and earth.


"petroleum usin' machines"? You got an electric boat or something?


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## TURTLE (May 22, 2008)

*Man I knew you were gonna get a new one ripped for this but Damn!*


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## aroundthehorn (Aug 29, 2010)

This thread went really well...


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## zulubravo34 (Dec 23, 2010)

Yakavelli said:


> "petroleum usin' machines"? You got an electric boat or something?


No he was talking about our trucks burning gas and hurting the environment... I was just saying how stupid his returning argument sounded


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## Yakavelli (Mar 17, 2010)

I got ya. Agreed.


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## Outside9 (Apr 30, 2008)

Nitzey said:


> In the Gulf, I sink my beer cans and soda bottles thinking that they are relatively clean and add to the reef, where ever I am. However, my wife disapproves of this and some of the people who fish with me. What do others think? I figure if it is relatively clean, it will add to the structure and barnacles, etc. will grow on it.


I have been following this thread since the beginning and have started to reply a few times. 

I'm pretty sure this is the most screwed up thing I have ever read on here. The Gulf is not your personal garbage dump for goodness sakes. If someone tossed trash off my boat I would be pissed. I carry a net with me just for picking up other's floating trash.

*Really, do you think throwing trash in the water is good for the environment?*


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## zulubravo34 (Dec 23, 2010)

Outside9 said:


> I have been following this thread since the beginning and have started to reply a few times.
> 
> I'm pretty sure this is the most screwed up thing I have ever read on here. The Gulf is not your personal garbage dump for goodness sakes. If someone tossed trash off my boat I would be pissed. I carry a net with me just for picking up other's floating trash.
> 
> Really, do you think throwing trash in the water is good for the environment?


So do we, always bring extra trash bags and such.... People just don't understand how sh**ty it looks and the harm I does to sea life.. Some people are so... Ignorant


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## nextstep (Jun 27, 2008)

sounds like a few have a problem with reading and comprehension

what, did you get bored and feel like spewing more forum pollution?

as a matter of fact i do have a compost pile in the bushes in front of my house with banana peels and apple cores in it.:thumbup:

classic:
"People just don't understand how sh**ty it looks and the harm I does to sea life.. Some people are so... Ignorant"

get over yourselfs and grow up.


my posts where about glass bottles ONLY, 12+ miles offshore where it happens to be completely legal. i also said i would stop for the sake of the civilized divers who ask me not to.

and 

i said OUR boats including myself have a bigger footprint than glass bottles sank 12+ miles ofshore. 

go find a fence post to argue with.

this is all i have to say on this matter.


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## bonita dan (Oct 3, 2007)

Wow,a full 7 pages of Ignorance! Not towards Nextstep but to the other Knuckleheads posting on this thread. How many of yall Torch carriers have ever been involved in the artificial reef system? IE:building,permitting,and finally(If the seas are right)deploying an artificial reef. Its a pain in the ass let me tell ya but its legal. Same thing like what Nextstep has done cept chose a different method of reefing. I'm sure he as well as the rest of us don't just wing an empty beer bottle out the side while cruising along but strategically placed over a certain area. 1 bottle is litterin but 5000 is a reef! :thumbup: I sir salute you! :notworthy: And any of ya whining SOB's that fish the bay and go,Hey,I found this great spot that marked up real well and we caught tons of fish,where do ya think that stuff came from? The sky? No,before Marine resources and other things came around,folks would dump stuff and after a little storm rolled thru(Began with an I,remember)plenty of folks stuff was washed into the bay and sound. The gulf is a flat wasteland cept for some limestone,limited coral heads and you guessed it,Man-made-reefs!!!! :thumbup:


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## bonita dan (Oct 3, 2007)

Oh yea,to the poster that bitched about broken glass. Wear flip-flops while walking around in 100+ feet of water. :thumbup:


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## aroundthehorn (Aug 29, 2010)

bonita dan said:


> Wow,a full 7 pages of Ignorance! Not towards Nextstep but to the other Knuckleheads posting on this thread. How many of yall Torch carriers have ever been involved in the artificial reef system? IE:building,permitting,and finally(If the seas are right)deploying an artificial reef. Its a pain in the ass let me tell ya but its legal. Same thing like what Nextstep has done cept chose a different method of reefing. I'm sure he as well as the rest of us don't just wing an empty beer bottle out the side while cruising along but strategically placed over a certain area. 1 bottle is litterin but 5000 is a reef! :thumbup: I sir salute you! :notworthy: And any of ya whining SOB's that fish the bay and go,Hey,I found this great spot that marked up real well and we caught tons of fish,where do ya think that stuff came from? The sky? No,before Marine resources and other things came around,folks would dump stuff and after a little storm rolled thru(Began with an I,remember)plenty of folks stuff was washed into the bay and sound. The gulf is a flat wasteland cept for some limestone,limited coral heads and you guessed it,Man-made-reefs!!!! :thumbup:


Thank you for your insight.


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## bonita dan (Oct 3, 2007)

Welcome.


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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

I have no problem with man made reefs but a bottle over the side? Bring it home and recycle it.


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## bonita dan (Oct 3, 2007)

Mudigger said:


> I have no problem with man made reefs but a bottle over the side? Bring it home and recycle it.


Useless at the dump or useful as a reef? No one knows man but all I know is the bottle produces fish and that the fact Jack!


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## marmidor (Mar 15, 2008)

bonita dan said:


> Useless at the dump or useful as a reef? No one knows man but all I know is the bottle produces fish and that the fact Jack!


Also a bottle that rolls around in the sand for a bit......well it turns back into sand!


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## SaltAddict (Jan 6, 2010)

nextstep said:


> sounds like a few have a problem with reading and comprehension
> 
> what, did you get bored and feel like spewing more forum pollution?
> 
> ...


The title of this thread is "Beer can reef." And your original post says "beer cans and soda bottles." So you are not talking about "just glass bottles." Besides, which sodas come in "glass bottles" these days? Not that you can't find them, but you have to search. I don't allow glass bottles on my boat (breakage on the boat). Now I will play devils advocate with a mixed message here: I am an avid diver, and I do not see much trash (cans or bottles) on wrecks. Which leads me to believe that current sweeps them off the wreck. Because I know there are knuckle heads a plenty who think it is ok to throw their trash overboard. Per square mile, we have more artificial reefs in this region than anywhere in the world. Adding your trash to it is not necessary.


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## Play'N Hooky Too (Sep 29, 2007)

Hell, just throw it *ALL* overboard! If it sinks it makes a reef, if it floats it holds cobia and dolphin right? *When* it washes up on the beach somebody will probably pick it up, but if not, who cares! It ain't my problem. I'm trying to have fun here and I ain't got time to be worried about keeping up with trash on my boat. Besides it keeps all those rich old F%$*s that live on the beach in shape bending and stooping picking up the trash. And it wasn't for kids needing stitches from stepping on broken beer bottles what would the doctors do all day?


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## Kim (Aug 5, 2008)

*The following is taken from the 2012 FWC Fishing Regulation booklet
*
*
*
*BOATER'S AND FISHERMAN'S*
*PLEDGE FOR A CLEAN GULF*
*I PLEDGE:*
*• To transport to shore, for proper*
*disposal, all trash generated*
*aboard my boat, especially plastic,*
*glass, and metal;*
*• To make every effort to prevent*
*accidental loss of food and drink*
*containers, fishing gear, and other*
*debris from my boat;*
*• To retrieve for proper disposal*
*onshore, plastic refuse, cans, and*
*other man-made debris I find*
*floating in navigable waters; and*
*• To encourage fellow boaters and*
*fishermen to “Take Pride in the*
*Gulf of Mexico.”*


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## jspooney (Oct 2, 2007)

I confess I am guilty of polluting our waters every time I go out. Without exception I pee at least 2 times and, at a minimum, leave at least 1 pretty hefty dump in the gulf. Wonder if that qualifies as "reef" material? Personally, I think this thread is pretty harsh. He's simply asking a question. Thanks Bonita Dan for setting this thing upright.


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## golfish (Jul 7, 2012)




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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

Play'N Hooky said:


> Hell, just throw it *ALL* overboard! If it sinks it makes a reef, if it floats it holds cobia and dolphin right? *When* it washes up on the beach somebody will probably pick it up, but if not, who cares! It ain't my problem. I'm trying to have fun here and I ain't got time to be worried about keeping up with trash on my boat. Besides it keeps all those rich old F%$*s that live on the beach in shape bending and stooping picking up the trash. And it wasn't for kids needing stitches from stepping on broken beer bottles what would the doctors do all day?


I would be fishing more if I didn't have to put in beer bottle stitches.


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## Smarty (Nov 23, 2008)

bonita dan said:


> Oh yea,to the poster that bitched about broken glass. Wear flip-flops while walking around in 100+ feet of water. :thumbup:


 Currents can move the glass. I'm quite sure it doesn't all stay that far out or end up on the beach as pretty little smooth glass stones. In 46yrs I've never seen the 1st one but I have found plenty of broken glass. The real point was for people not to be lazy and be responsible and respectful to our waterways. But what the hell, who cares right. Next time you walk out to your mailbox and step into a big steaming pile of shit, don't bitch. Just tell yourself man I shouldn't complain, after all it is biodegradable :yes:


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## bonita dan (Oct 3, 2007)

This just reminds me to never argue with an idiot,they will drag you down to there level and beat you with experience! They original discussion was about reefs then turned to litter which led to me stepping in Poo that someones mutt left in front of my mailbox. I see this going nowhere fast. Have a Bud55 day! :thumbup:


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## bigrick (Sep 29, 2010)

Bonita Dan i think we all know who the idiot is. First of all I've built and legally permitted reefs and there's a reason you can't make them out of plastic and glass. And if you think bottles drop straight down and dont move than nothing you say from this point really matters. Bring your trash home dumbass


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## bonita dan (Oct 3, 2007)

Excuse me Mr.Big Rick but I don't throw trash in the water which is basically my back yard. Matter of fact I have pulled more crap out of the water(buckets,balloons from the beach,etc.) than I have brought with me to discard at the house. My comments where that a bottle reef works to produce fish. Plain and simple and don't think that your reefs whether rebar or whatever won't move with strong current or a storm. And I'm sure your dumbass comment couldn't have possibly been directed at a upstanding law abiding citizen such as myself.


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## aroundthehorn (Aug 29, 2010)

What is the point in calling people dumbasses and idiots?


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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

Makes me feel better when a use them in the same sentence with my exwife's name.

:whistling:


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## southern yakker (Jun 25, 2012)

aroundthehorn said:


> What is the point in calling people dumbasses and idiots?


Because theyre retarded.haha

The chances of a bottle you dropped landing on the reef is very smal.just keep your trash and pick up other trash along the way.simple as that.


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## Outside9 (Apr 30, 2008)

I'm going to cancel my garbage pick up and just start carrying everything offshore. Hell, if I will drop everything in 80 plus foot of water it will sink perfectly on top of each other and build me my own hidden spot.

Can't believe I never think of this before!


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## zulubravo34 (Dec 23, 2010)

Big Rick is right, and it may be LEGAL but is it RIGHT? Absolutely not. Nextstep, you had this one coming, saying that in the most respectful way. Those who call the people who care about keeping the waters clean dumbasses.... Look into a friggin mirror.


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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

Fifteen pages?

:thumbdown:


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## Smarty (Nov 23, 2008)

Some people you just can't reason with because they'll always feel they're right. If a heavy artificial reef can be moved by current in a storm than what could make someone believe a reef made of someones unwanted trash would remain in place and produce fish. I for one don't get the concept or the lack of real character of some. If you live at such a high standard as to pick up others trash then why not do the same with your own garbage. Damn sorry, there I go again using common sense. What was I thinking :wallbash:


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## Nitzey (Oct 9, 2007)

Well, I must say that a late night question in my mind has become quite a topic of discussion. Thanks to Nextstep and Bonita Dan and several others who have posted intelligent responses. 
Here is a little science for those of you who are interested. Water right next to the bottom will not move; it is called the no-slip principle. Above the bottom is a boundary layer, over which the velocity will rise from zero to whatever. If this is unfamiliar to you, then think of this. At the beach, when the wind is blowing strongly, then lie down on a blanket and you will feel little wind. The no-slip and boundary layer apply to air too. 
Anyway, net result is that a bottle or can on the bottom is unlikely to move but a large structure, such as a sunken ship, might move in storms and hurricanes. So, these small objects should add to a reef. In no small time, they should be covered with barnacles and other such creatures that need a solid object for attachment. 
Some have mentioned that with a current, small objects might not fall to the reef. Sure, but a good artificial reef expands naturally with time, as corals build on corals, oysters build on oyster shells and so forth. 
However, bottom line: the original question is what other people thought about this (sinking bottles and cans) and when divers tell me that they see bottles and cans at Green's Hole, I cannot help but thinking that we should bring them back. I will suggest to the marina where I keep my boat to add a recycle bin as now everybody dumps everything in the nearest available trash container (where therefore everything ends up in the land fill). By the way, and something to think about, my colleague is from Sweden and she says there are no such things as landfills there; they recycle everything.


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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

Yes, unfortunately we are a wasteful society. Most of the people of the world could live on what we throw away.


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## SaltAddict (Jan 6, 2010)

Nitzey said:


> Well, I must say that a late night question in my mind has become quite a topic of discussion. Thanks to Nextstep and Bonita Dan and several others who have posted intelligent responses.
> Here is a little science for those of you who are interested. Water right next to the bottom will not move; it is called the no-slip principle. Above the bottom is a boundary layer, over which the velocity will rise from zero to whatever. If this is unfamiliar to you, then think of this. At the beach, when the wind is blowing strongly, then lie down on a blanket and you will feel little wind. The no-slip and boundary layer apply to air too.
> Anyway, net result is that a bottle or can on the bottom is unlikely to move but a large structure, such as a sunken ship, might move in storms and hurricanes. So, these small objects should add to a reef. In no small time, they should be covered with barnacles and other such creatures that need a solid object for attachment.
> Some have mentioned that with a current, small objects might not fall to the reef. Sure, but a good artificial reef expands naturally with time, as corals build on corals, oysters build on oyster shells and so forth.
> However, bottom line: the original question is what other people thought about this (sinking bottles and cans) and when divers tell me that they see bottles and cans at Green's Hole, I cannot help but thinking that we should bring them back. I will suggest to the marina where I keep my boat to add a recycle bin as now everybody dumps everything in the nearest available trash container (where therefore everything ends up in the land fill). By the way, and something to think about, my colleague is from Sweden and she says there are no such things as landfills there; they recycle everything.


I disagree with this. When the wind blows on the beach and catches a grain of sand, it only flys so far. Then it crashes into other grains of sand and they go flying. Things on the bottom do move. No matter how small. This is no theory... I've been down there watching it take place. Matter of fact, I will be down there in about 3 hours.


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## zulubravo34 (Dec 23, 2010)

SaltAddict said:


> I disagree with this. When the wind blows on the beach and catches a grain of sand, it only flys so far. Then it crashes into other grains of sand and they go flying. Things on the bottom do move. No matter how small. This is no theory... I've been down there watching it take place. Matter of fact, I will be down there in about 3 hours.


Go pro it!!


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## 285exp (Oct 17, 2007)

It's really hard to believe that someone would actually ask that question seriously, and harder to believe that there are people here defending him. It's garbage, it's not adding value to the reef, and you're just trying to rationalize dumb and inconsiderate behavior.


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## Smarty (Nov 23, 2008)

SaltAddict said:


> I disagree with this. When the wind blows on the beach and catches a grain of sand, it only flys so far. Then it crashes into other grains of sand and they go flying. Things on the bottom do move. No matter how small. This is no theory... I've been down there watching it take place. Matter of fact, I will be down there in about 3 hours.


If this "no slip principle" was true then there would be no such thing as an undertow that pulls the sand right out from under your feet when you're in the surf as the current is going back out. I no scientist but think I'm going to disagree as well.


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## WDE (Jul 24, 2012)

This is ridiculous. Honestly.


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## 3BARKINGSPIDERS (Mar 2, 2012)

WOW? Agree with most here. Trash should go in the trash not in the gulf. But... How many of you high and mighties are throwing your cigerette butts out the car window or on my lawn while walking your dogs in front of my house? It's called respect. Respect nature and others. Forget the reefs. Whether the bottom currents move stuff or any other argument. Fish or land animals if big enough EAT this crap. Like us they can't digest it. Caught a Red Snapper this year with bottle cap in stomach. It's now hanging in my boat area. (Cap) Damn fish are finicky as helll but will eat a bottle cap??? WOW Again... It's about respecting the enviroment AND OTHER HUMAN BEINGS. Please throw your trash where it belongs. On land, on the water, where it belongs.

Mike


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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

3barkingspiders said:


> wow? Agree with most here. Trash should go in the trash not in the gulf. But... How many of you high and mighties are throwing your cigerette butts out the car window or on my lawn while walking your dogs in front of my house? It's called respect. Respect nature and others. Forget the reefs. Whether the bottom currents move stuff or any other argument. Fish or land animals if big enough eat this crap. Like us they can't digest it. Caught a red snapper this year with bottle cap in stomach. It's now hanging in my boat area. (cap) damn fish are finicky as helll but will eat a bottle cap??? Wow again... It's about respecting the enviroment and other human beings. Please throw your trash where it belongs. On land, on the water, where it belongs.
> 
> Mike


amen, brother, amen!


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## JustnCase (May 25, 2012)

with the costs of producing glass and aluminum, why dump in the ocean? recycle it, and keep the ocean floor natural, while getting Budweiser's cans and bottles back to them...keeps beer prices down, most important of all. LOL


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## WDE (Jul 24, 2012)

If you honestly think that throwing multiple beer cans in the ocean will make a reef, you should be thrown in...


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## SaltAddict (Jan 6, 2010)

I imagine the OP is chucklin' his nuts about how many hits this thread has generated. I doubt it was serious.


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## marmidor (Mar 15, 2008)

SaltAddict said:


> I imagine the OP is chucklin' his nuts about how many hits this thread has generated. I doubt it was serious.


Hahaha you may be on to something salt!!!


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## Mudigger (Aug 5, 2011)

Oh well, good for him. At least they won't delete the thread unless we suggest that some local merchant is behind the free for all beer reef.


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