# Lionfish Tech



## WhackUmStackUm

Our lionfish hunters need to be equipped to make efficient use of their time and energy. Providing them with new weapons and tools may help them make a difference.

I started this thread as a place where we could discuss innovations and ideas related to lionfish control.

Could we keep our ideas to ourselves, patent them, and make a little money? Perhaps. However, I encourage you to consciously choose to make a difference, rather than make a little money.

Your idea need not be the "ultimate solution." It may inspire someone else.


Whack 'um


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## BananaTom

*SUCK-IT Lion Fish*

*I have thought about this, after watching videos. It appears they are on reefs in large numbers. They are not skidish, therefore; they just seem to float, and not swim. There needs to a Lion Fish Vaccum manufactured.*

*I am thinking a large, very large wet vac tank on the vessel, with a long hose on a reel, with an ball cock valve at the suction end.*

*The diver gets the hose into position, the vac is running, he opens the ball valve and:*

*suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,*
*suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,*
*suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck,suck.*

*There you have it, 50 sucked up Lion Fish, in 3 minutes.*


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## DawnsKayBug

I have used this to catch fish in Guam for my aquarium. They make handheld ones although I think the fins would get in the way if its sucked in backwards. Why not "gig" them and let them die becoming crab food. Why not put a per fish bounty on them funded by FWC with funds from whatever.


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## WhackUmStackUm

*Lionfish Chum-o-matic*

This is similar to an idea I have been thinking about. Although I have not considered a boat-based powered vacuum. I guess you could use a rig like those used by treasure hunters and archeologists.

*The Lionfish Chum-o-matic:*

Thanks to Scott (FirefishVideo) for proposing the name.

This is a scuba tank-powered pump that sucks a lionfish past fixed blades in a tube. The pump/gun then reverses and blows the fish out past the blades a second time, creating lionfish-flavored chum.

A different barrel could be attached to capture fish rather than destroy them. It could look something like a reservoir in a paint spray gun.

The air-powered pump is the only challenging component I can think of. Perhaps the trigger may take some time to work out. I'll post my sketches of the pump when I get a chance.


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## WhackUmStackUm

*Lionfish Chum-o-matic*

Here is a sketch of the high-level operation. I apologize, my artistic skills are somewhat...underdeveloped.

I'll post the pump sketch later.

The chum "exhaust" could be directed out a another port, if needed.


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## Telum Pisces

DawnsKayBug said:


> Why not "gig" them and let them die becoming crab food.


Because they are very yummy!


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## WhackUmStackUm

DawnsKayBug said:


> ...Why not "gig" them and let them die becoming crab food.


They tend to be easy to wound but hard to kill. According to a biologists I friend of mine, they often recover from a pole spear stab wound.


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## Fish-n-Fur

...according to an armor friend of mine, a powerhead would leave them lifeless :whistling: 
KISS principle - pole spear/hawaiian sling.


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## DawnsKayBug

Telum Pisces said:


> Because they are very yummy!


Then lets get them to be something people ask for at a seafood restaurant. Bring up the cost per pound to make it worth to kill. Make it where u do not need a fish sellers license to sell to seafood places. Make it worth my while economically to fish for.


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## WhackUmStackUm

*Lionfish Chum-o-matic*

Here is a crude drawing of the *Lionfish Chum-o-matic* pump section. 

I left out the seals to simplify the drawing. It would be driven from a connection low pressure port on a scuba regulator, provided the intermediate pressure would be sufficient. Otherwise it would need to be driven by a connection to a high pressure port.

It is essentially an air-powered single action water pump. I have some sketches of a double-acting pump as well. Air would be used in place of the spring in the double-acting version.

Sorry, I hope you can read my chicken scratching.

Errata:

 In step 2 I meant to say "B & D are at ambient pressure," rather than C & D.


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## ul412al




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## DawnsKayBug

They make that with out the blades. Or used to. Fishes eyes would get sucked out due to the pressure so obviously their popularity was fading quick.


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## WhackUmStackUm

*Lionfish Chum-o-matic*

Here is a simpler *Chum-o-matic.* It is a simple scuba tank-powered lift pump with blades and optional flexible hose intake. An alternative configuration would be to omit the blades and put a net on the top of the lift. The exhaust could be redirected with a hose or elbow.


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## no woryz

WhackUmStackUm said:


> Here is a crude drawing of the *Lionfish Chum-o-matic* pump section.
> 
> I left out the seals to simplify the drawing. It would be driven from a connection low pressure port on a *scuba regulator*, provided the intermediate pressure would be sufficient. Otherwise it would need to be driven by a connection to a high pressure port.
> 
> It is essentially an air-powered single action water pump. I have some sketches of a double-acting pump as well. Air would be used in place of the spring in the double-acting version.
> 
> Sorry, I hope you can read my *chicken* scratching.
> 
> Errata:
> 
> In step 2 I meant to say "B & D are at ambient pressure," rather than C & D.


Bryan, I highlighed a few words that are apparently universal in any language but could you repost the rest of it in English so that I may understand what you are saying....lol...... "it was my understanding that there would be no math during the Debate"

Interesting ideas here though....... get a protoytype built and we will run it through trials.....


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## WhackUmStackUm

*Lionfish death wand*

Here is a sketch of a lionfish death wand. Of course no one in his right mind would build one...but I might anyway.

It uses a charging circuit similar to the ones used in camera flash units. A super capacitor of the proper size (TBD) would replace the normal flash cap. It could probably be powered by a couple of AA batteries. The electrodes would be insulated except at the tips. The box containing the electronics would be waterproofed of course.

The charge circuit would charge the super capacitor. It would make the characteristic whining sound as it charges. Once the tone stabilizes and the LED lights up, then it is ready to fire. I would capture a lionfish with a landing net or pole spear. Touch the electrodes to the lionfish (preferably on the head) and pull the trigger..._as I laugh in an evil manner_. The energy stored in the capacitor would be discharged between the electrodes. If they are touching the fish, then the fish would be electrocuted. If they are not touching the fish, then the current would travel through the saltwater between the electrodes, this being the path of least resistance. It would probably also make any shark in the neighborhood jump, as they are very sensitive to electromagnetic pulses.

This may indeed be a candidate for the Darwin Awards. So don't build it. However, it is fun to think about should you embrace your inner Frankenstein!


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## WhackUmStackUm

no woryz said:


> Bryan, I highlighed a few words that are apparently universal in any language but could you repost the rest of it in English so that I may understand what you are saying....lol...... "it was my understanding that there would be no math during the Debate"
> 
> Interesting ideas here though....... get a protoytype built and we will run it through trials.....


LOL

Sorry Clint, I thought you spoke Geek as well as English.


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## cuzmondo

DawnsKayBug said:


> Then lets get them to be something people ask for at a seafood restaurant. Bring up the cost per pound to make it worth to kill. Make it where u do not need a fish sellers license to sell to seafood places. Make it worth my while economically to fish for.


That was proposed by a couple guys on a TV show. Don't recall the name of the show, but it's a regular show about folks with entrepreneurial ideas. It was a huge flop. It's just not economically feasible since the only proven method of taking them is diving. They don't take bait, so it would take a lot of divers to keep a sustainable, marketable supply going. Too many shitty weather days, expensive method of harvest, etc.


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## cuzmondo

No need for complicated gear and techniques. A lion tamer, heavy canvas bag, or fabricated bucket, and some good gloves will do the trick. Dumbest and easiest fish in the world to spear, but be careful handling them.


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## tailfisher1979

I have to admit that this is one of the more entertaining threads I've seen in awhile. Keep up the good work. Kill em all.


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## WhackUmStackUm

tailfisher1979 said:


> ...Kill em all.


...and let God sort 'um out.


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## WhackUmStackUm

*Lionfish Machete*

Another idea for a simple device to kill lionfish is the *Lionfish Machete*. The traditional pole spear tip would be replaced with a sharp 4-6 inch blade, similar to a vegetable chopper. The pole spear would be used in the normal way but the fish would be chopped rather than pierced. This may increase the likelihood that a lionfish would be mortally wounded, and there is no need to remove them from the spear tip.

Rather than replacing the spear tip, an adapter could be made to slip over an existing tip. If you need more power (and who doesn't?), a pneumatic propelled version could be designed.


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## WhackUmStackUm

cuzmondo said:


> No need for complicated gear and techniques....Dumbest and easiest fish in the world to spear...


Yes, lionfish would have us believe that they are dumb and slow...in order to lull us into a false sense of security! In fact they are the most intelligent, cannibalistic, brutal, vicious, enemy that man has faced since the first goldfish escaped from captivity. 

If we are to protect our way of life, and our interests around the Gulf, then all lionfish must be killed...or appear to have been killed...or perpetually detained in a place where US laws do no apply.


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## Candy

DawnsKayBug said:


> I have used this to catch fish in Guam for my aquarium. They make handheld ones although I think the fins would get in the way if its sucked in backwards. Why not "gig" them and let them die becoming crab food. Why not put a per fish bounty on them funded by FWC with funds from whatever.


DawnsKayBug,
I presented a lionfish population control program to the FWC back in June that would provide a fishing exemption for divers who removed 100 lionfish. They want to hear other ideas so, they are holding a summit in October in Cocoa Beach Florida. I'll be there to present the findings of the dive survey that is here: www.ecreef.org.

One of the choices is a bounty. Why not take the survey and choose what would be the most motivating choice for you.


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## Orion45

Here's my idea. Very simple, portable and easy to machine.

A 19 cubic foot aluminum tank or greater worn attached to an air tank or like a bailout bottle. Rubber hose attached to the LP port of a common regulator set to approximately 140 psi. The other end of the hose is attached to a hollow aluminum pole spear with threaded connectors. In between the regulator and the pole spear, attach a common air nozzle. Depressing lever allows the passage of air from the tank to the spear.

Air passes through the hollow pole spear to the point. The point to be machined as pictured. Tip of point is solid but remainder od point is hollow with two opposing orifices. A small circular stop is welded a distance (d) from the orifices. This distance is approximately half of the thickness of an average lionfish.

The purpose of the circular stop is to position the orifices in the middle of the lionfish. Once speared, the diver depresses the air nozzle forcing air into the lionfish's body causing massive internal damage. 

Pull spear point out of fish and get ready for the next one.

A fast and simple version of a power point. Easy to operate with two hands. Oh yeah...I want a cut of the profits. 

Forgot to add a one way valve at the end of the pole spear where it attaches to the point. This will prevent water from travelling up the spear. Of course, any water would also be expelled through the orifice and would penetrate the body of the lionfish with equally damaging results....in theory.


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## Orion45

WhackUmStackUm said:


> Another idea for a simple device to kill lionfish is the *Lionfish Machete*. The traditional pole spear tip would be replaced with a sharp 4-6 inch blade, similar to a vegetable chopper. The pole spear would be used in the normal way but the fish would be chopped rather than pierced. This may increase the likelihood that a lionfish would be mortally wounded, and there is no need to remove them from the spear tip.
> 
> Rather than replacing the spear tip, an adapter could be made to slip over an existing tip. If you need more power (and who doesn't?), a pneumatic propelled version could be designed.


Good and simple. I would recommend shapping the "machete" in the form of a triangle (arrow point). This would allow for more penetration and a deeper wound.


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## WhackUmStackUm

Orion45 said:


> Here's my idea. Very simple, portable and easy to machine.
> 
> A 19 cubic foot aluminum tank or greater worn attached to an air tank or like a bailout bottle. Rubber hose attached to the LP port of a common regulator set to approximately 140 psi. The other end of the hose is attached to a hollow aluminum pole spear with threaded connectors. In between the regulator and the pole spear, attach a common air nozzle. Depressing lever allows the passage of air from the tank to the spear.
> 
> Air passes through the hollow pole spear to the point. The point to be machined as pictured. Tip of point is solid but remainder od point is hollow with two opposing orifices. A small circular stop is welded a distance (d) from the orifices. This distance is approximately half of the thickness of an average lionfish.
> 
> The purpose of the circular stop is to position the orifices in the middle of the lionfish. Once speared, the diver depresses the air nozzle forcing air into the lionfish's body causing massive internal damage.
> 
> Pull spear point out of fish and get ready for the next one.
> 
> A fast and simple version of a power point. Easy to operate with two hands. Oh yeah...I want a cut of the profits.
> 
> Forgot to add a one way valve at the end of the pole spear where it attaches to the point. This will prevent water from travelling up the spear. Of course, any water would also be expelled through the orifice and would penetrate the body of the lionfish with equally damaging results....in theory.
> 
> View attachment 135865


 
Cool! *Lionfish Inflate-o-matic*!


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## lastcast

Would a sliding weight ( cut air grooves) inside the shaft, have enough inertia, to push the air used for propulsion to blow into the fish?:001_huh:


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## Orion45

Like a piston?


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## lastcast

Yea.


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## Orion45

If you referring to my diagram, a piston is not needed because the compressed air is supplied by the tank.


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## Orion45

WhackUmStackUm said:


> Cool! *Lionfish Inflate-o-matic*!


Of course, the entire system can be built to withstand 5,000 p.s.i. I figure injecting air at 3,000 p.s.i. into the lionfish will convert it into instant fish food. 

Concerning your "machete." That's probably the best solution to try first. A triangular piece of steel wide enough at the base to slice completely through the lionfish welded on a pole spear point. If the impact is not strong enough to slice through the lion fish, just pin the lionfish against the sand and force the point through. That should slice it in half...provided you oriented the point correctly initially.

I took the liberty to change your drawing to reflect the new "machete blade."

That should require minimal effort and cost to build.


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## WhackUmStackUm

Orion45 said:


> Of course, the entire system can be built to withstand 5,000 p.s.i. I figure injecting air at 3,000 p.s.i. into the lionfish will convert it into instant fish food.


Now that's what I'm talking about!

I guess you could use a CO2 rig for gas and freeze the buggers while you were inflating them.



Orion45 said:


> Concerning your "machete." That's probably the best solution to try first. A triangular piece of steel wide enough at the base to slice completely through the lionfish welded on a pole spear point. If the impact is not strong enough to slice through the lion fish, just pin the lionfish against the sand and force the point through. That should slice it in half...provided you oriented the point correctly initially.
> 
> I took the liberty to change your drawing to reflect the new "machete blade."
> 
> That should require minimal effort and cost to build.


Great idea!


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## SaltAddict

How about a 3 prong paralyzer tip on your choice of pole spear (I prefer 4'). Then with the other hand, you just slice the perp with this:










If a lionfish has spines longer than that knife, you probably already scared it off with that poop smell in your wetsuit. 

Now, to make a sheath to hold that thing.


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## Orion45

WhackUmStackUm said:


> Now that's what I'm talking about!
> 
> I guess you could use a CO2 rig for gas and freeze the buggers while you were inflating them.
> 
> 
> 
> Great idea!


Original idea was yours.


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## Orion45

SaltAddict said:


> How about a 3 prong paralyzer tip on your choice of pole spear (I prefer 4'). Then with the other hand, you just slice the perp with this:
> 
> 
> View attachment 136361
> 
> 
> If a lionfish has spines longer than that knife, you probably already scared it off with that poop smell in your wetsuit.
> 
> Now, to make a sheath to hold that thing.


Another option.


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