# need help with new flounder rig



## lagoon charters

Just got my air motor together and I'm having a problem with bad vibrations on acceleration .... 

The unit consist of a Honda clone (predator) 13 HP with a 36" 3 blade composite prop. It is mounted to my existing poling platform that is built out of 1"5/8 pipe rigid as can be but tall. The engine is mounted to a 1/2" plate of aluminum that is mounted to a wheel bearing hub attached to poling platform. 

I am having severe vibrations at mid throttle. The engine will run smooth at idle and at wide open throttle (3,300 rpms) I thought it needed more bracing so added it and still the same. Also exchanged engine and still the same. Engine was hard mounted so I thought that was it so I added neopreme bushings and still the same. Pulled prop checked balance and checked good. Ran engine without prop and no vibration put prop back on and vibration returned. Tested prop in everyway I was told by Manufactor and all I could find was an 1/8" difference on one blade if that. 

I'm just wondering if its just normal or am I missing something. Any and all recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. 

Capt. Travis


----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## drifterfisher

Do you have a way to spin the prop with out the engine? An 1/8" in a 36" blade is alot at 3K RPM.A boat prop shop might could help.If thats not it,it might be the engine,offset cut crank shaft.A dial indicator would verify this.


----------



## lagoon charters

Thanks for your reply.... I've checked the prop and it was barely out within manufactures specs lol as they say. What has me puzzled is that if it was the prop wouldn't it get worse as the rpm's increased. As is it gets smoother at wide open throttle no vibration at all from the norm as well as being smooth at idle. I originally thought the counter balance was off so I exchanged engine and ran it on the bench and it had no vib at any range. We measured the tip of the prop at the same position and found one blade off but within specs as per manufacture ... Just didn't know if I was over reacting or is this normal.


----------



## drifterfisher

Another thing to think about,thats a single cylinder engine,think of ya lawn mower and how it vibrates.And theres a whole bunch at play when that prop gets added to an engine,its more complicated than what I know.If its to bad,you might try a pulley system where the prop is separate from the engine.

Just how bad is the vibration? Think lawn mower,one with new blade,VS one with bent/wore out blade?

Yes and no one the vibration getting worse or better as the RPM's increase,harmonics/dynamic come into play there.Kinda like a tire out of balance on your truck,if its just a little out you notice that at certain speeds its smooth,but slower/faster it beats ya to death,same concept with the prop.

If you have a way of measuring the prop while on the engine you might find it there,turn the engine by hand,and measure each blade's run out.And I dont think an 1/8" is acceptable.


----------



## dallis

I may have missed something but did you weigh the blades? Are they fixed pitch?


----------



## lagoon charters

Thanks again and I agree that an 1/8 inch at 3400 rpms is way to much as did manufacture they agreed to send a new one. I also talked with a fabricator in Texas that has built several and I explained the symptoms and the first thing he asked as he laughed was it sitting on the trailer and it hit me lol it was and had little to know vibration in the water... Thanks million for your reply. I'm sure what vibrations are there will be cured by the new prop.


----------



## lagoon charters

Blades are adjustable with blocks. Weight was right on.


----------



## drifterfisher

Still shouldnt vibrate on trailer or water....let us know how the new blade does.
BTW where did you get the blade???


----------



## lagoon charters

Blade came from completion aircraft. Will do on the progress. Home to post so pics of a few door mats soon. Thanks again


----------



## Death From Above

Have you tested to see how shallow you can go with that boat/motor?


----------



## lagoon charters

Yes sir... Boat is a Shallow Sport 18' 7'6" wide drafts 6" at rest will run in 4-5" sweetest flats boat there is for getting skinny.... They are built in Texas... Videos online.


----------



## lagoon charters

Set ul


----------



## lagoon charters

Light set no more generators


----------



## drifterfisher

Where and how much? on the lights,And how good do they do?


----------



## Death From Above

lagoon charters said:


> Yes sir... Boat is a Shallow Sport 18' 7'6" wide drafts 6" at rest will run in 4-5" sweetest flats boat there is for getting skinny.... They are built in Texas... Videos online.


I'd have to see that to believe it. I don't care how wide it is, 4-5" with a F115 pulling down the stern???? I highly doubt it.


----------



## lagoon charters

Death From Above said:


> I'd have to see that to believe it. I don't care how wide it is, 4-5" with a F115 pulling down the stern???? I highly doubt it.


Check out the site and videos see for yourself ain't got no reason to lie man you asked and I said. I'll be glad to take you for a ride sometime if you dare lol. www.shallowsport.com been running these boats for over ten years. Videos all over net.


----------



## lagoon charters

I've already taken three $100 bets and took there money be glad to take more. Lol


----------



## lagoon charters

check this out don't agree with blowing through grass but it should settle the ?


----------



## The Barb

*13hp motor*

Hello,Is that a Kohler motor?I just ordered a new 14hp,hub and 3 blade prop,(34 inch)my question is the one I ordered is electric start and picts shows a wiring harness like yours,did you have to order a different harness to plug in to go to the battery to start? Motor has not got here yet so it might be self explained on arrival. Also what did you use for the throttle to reach from front of boat to motor and who did you order it from.Thank you for your time.


----------



## lagoon charters

I ordered my prop through completion aircraft great people bent over backwards to help.

Engine is a Honda clone (Predator from Harbor Freight $340 with a 2 year no hassle replacement warranty) it is 420cc electric start it says 13hp but U.S. rates it at 15hp as per research from the web.

I bought all my wiring from the surplus boat store in Fort Pierce they have binds there your choice $5 per pound. Can't beat it there was several factory harness there and were marine grade wiring (would not skimp on that either make sure its marine grade or it won't last. 

I am using a 150 # holding strength 12volt accuator to steer controlled by a momentary toggle switch. 

The throttle cable I used was purchased from Arrow Propeller in oklahoma good people but very slow on shipping, but they were about the only place could find it in bulk. I used their T handle for control and they also have all the fittings you will need for rigging it (make sure to get the stainless innerwire not the solid push/pull type. And then all you have to do is buy a heavy spring for your throttle return. 

All I have is one wire loom running to the front of my boat very clean and simple. I used a outdoor box with a hinged water proof cover and mounted all controls in it. On the wiring I left the key switch on the engine (factory) just incase the front ever failed... I just purchased a marine ignition switch from Napa for my front. Wired it up as normal.

I'll post some pics of the progress tomorrow. I've also decided to rebuild my stand wanted to add a few touches so I picked up metal today and should get pipe bender tomorrow UPS. And a tig welding we will go.


----------



## RedAlert

you might could try reenforcing the platform its mounted on. When its idling theres no force on it and when ur at full trottle its forced back. so ur in between may be causing the vibration.


----------



## tyler0421

lagoon charters said:


> Light set no more generators


 
Where did you find this light setup? Or did you make it.. Tell us about it.


----------



## lagoon charters

I sell the lights message me for detail.


----------



## lagoon charters

new platform underway


----------



## lagoon charters

Added side platforms so when we are sight fishing.


----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## drifterfisher

lookin good :thumbsup:


----------



## lagoon charters

Thanks... I figured I better just rebuild it right. I'm gonna mount my poling platform about 3' above the plate and bearing hub for fan. Planning on attaching it using 1 1/4 pipe for collars and 1" pipe for legs then weld collars to legs as a stopping point and anchor with set screws on collars. That way I can easily remove it and install air motor. Poling platform should be around 7'-8' off of boat deck. Nose bleed lol should be able to spot them reds before they spooky. Tacked everything today lots of torch time tomorrow.


----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## lagoon charters

Got a little bit done this weekend....


----------



## The Barb

could you please send me a picture of your waterproof box with the throttle handle?I checked out Arrow Prop,did you buy the push pull t-handle or which one did you order for the throttle,motor will be here friday,I need to order my throttle cable but am alittle confused on which one you used and how?Also send some picts of actuator?,I was going to use steering cable since I already have a rotary helm and wheel but I was not going to use wheel,stick steering?but still have to order steering cable,Your way might be alot cheaper,where did you order the actuator from?My motor(Kohler,electric start)14hp,prop and hub was alittle over a grand,already built frame with trailer hub mounted to poling platform,trying to figure the cheapest and best way for steering and throttle,def. going to order throttle cable but throttle assembly upfront need your advise on and steering,thanks alot for any imput...


----------



## lagoon charters

The Barb said:


> could you please send me a picture of your waterproof box with the throttle handle?I checked out Arrow Prop,did you buy the push pull t-handle or which one did you order for the throttle,motor will be here friday,I need to order my throttle cable but am alittle confused on which one you used and how?Also send some picts of actuator?,I was going to use steering cable since I already have a rotary helm and wheel but I was not going to use wheel,stick steering?but still have to order steering cable,Your way might be alot cheaper,where did you order the actuator from?My motor(Kohler,electric start)14hp,prop and hub was alittle over a grand,already built frame with trailer hub mounted to poling platform,trying to figure the cheapest and best way for steering and throttle,def. going to order throttle cable but throttle assembly upfront need your advise on and steering,thanks alot for any imput...


Sure can. I purchased the T handle ordered right or left hand mount but sent a one way mount but I made it work anyway.. if you are going to put a stick steer I would go with a PTO throttle control they are available through Napa with a 20' cable they have a twist lock and you can push it in to release. 

The cable: Conduit - 3/16" Plastic lined, plastic covered. For use with solid wireor cable.

C316WP $1.00 ft.

Stainless Steel Innerwire 1 x 19 aircraft cable. (1 strand of 19 wires) 
C364 $1.00 ft.

The push pull will kink and is not as smooth at long links. 

The actuator was purchased online. http://ProgressiveAutomations.com/m....html?osCsid=8c4a69fc88951a011f014f11a979a8b9 

The way I figured my length is: I measured the max travel distance the engine could turn without the fan hitting the stand. Then I moved it back to center for example my airmotor was able to turn 8" to the left and 8" to right so I purchased a 16" travel acuator and extended out to 8" and mounted it with the airmotor at center this gave me the correct travel either way. It also allowed the installed limits to work without binding the acuator motor. All you will need is a momentary switch up front in you control box. I'll post some pics tonight. I just didn't like the thought of all the cables in the boat and it really cut out a lot of wieght.. 50-150 lb holding strength should be plenty.


----------



## The Barb

*Steering and controll box*

Hello Again,I just want to Thank you for your input,I ordered my throttle cable today from ArrowProp,Now I am considering going with your setup on the steering,my question is useing the auctuator and the switch does it turn fast,about like a helm or does it react slow with a pause,also when it hits the motor stop do you know,I guess Im trying to say with a helm you feel a stop on the wheel or stick steering,if you continue to hold switch will it burn up actuator? and does it turn ,reaction time like a helm? I understand centering the pin of the act. on your turn radius and ordering the right one so when it is fully extended you are at your most turn radius but does the switch stop?want be able to hear it with motor running?I realize I will be floundering slow but some areas I fish have alot of docks,I have to go out around and back in,Can you please post some picts of your controll box if you dont mind,I have everthing worked out except the steering,I will post some pict of mine shortly,I am still using a Generator with the digital ballast,my boat is the grizzly tracker,camo,20ft 6 inch,I extended the front deck back,carpeted,added inch and half front rails,even have a 24 volt trolling motor mounted center front,works great but sometimes I get so shallow on the flats the trolling motor hits and I have to pole,thats why going to have air motor on back.AGAIN I want to Thank you for your time and Great Ideals,I look forward to seeing your controll box and how its laid out,Thanks Again,and Yes I have adjusted trolling motor so the prop is just under the water surface but it floats so shallow I can pole in to the beach and litterly step out on dry land so when you say you can run shallow I believe.....


----------



## willie b

tyler0421 said:


> Where did you find this light setup? Or did you make it.. Tell us about it.


Looks like the ones from this site. http://www.GigFlounder.com


----------



## lagoon charters

willie b said:


> Looks like the ones from this site. http://www.GigFlounder.com


Not even close.


----------



## lagoon charters

Mine


----------



## lagoon charters

THEIRS


----------



## lagoon charters

Not saying anything is wrong with theirs but not the same at all.


----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## lagoon charters

My acuator runs about 1"-1.5" per second not fast but plenty fast for me. The have faster just have to call and discuss and for the money if it ain't fast enough ill just send it back and get a faster one. Lol.


----------



## lagoon charters

Sorry I haven't installed throttle yet will have it in this weekend. Hope to wrap it up Saturday and weather permitting go fishing Saturday night or sunday.


----------



## lagoon charters

BEEN FIGHTING LIGHTNING STRIKE FOR THE PAST TWO DAYS.


----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## willie b

Yes sir, your right. Yours looks like the bigger, badder light system. P.M.ed for more info. Currently wrestling with 1x4's and starfire/pvc setup; guess everybody's got to start somewhere. OH, haven't been in a smoker like those pics, since Mother's Day fire in Beulah. Be careful- stay in the black.


----------



## lagoon charters

Well guys she hit the pond today and it worked awesome. Pushed the boat way faster than I would have ever thought. Gotta do so tweaking on the steering but I am very pleased with the results planes out nice and only drafted 7" awesome. Going to get the brackets fabed up for the lights and hit the water this weekend. Will post pic tomorrow.


----------



## lagoon charters

LIGHTS INSTALLED


----------



## lagoon charters




----------



## drifterfisher

Way nice! All it takes is money...


----------



## lagoon charters

Lol I hear ya there. Not bad though figured it would 
be my last lol ya right....its an addiction. 

$490 per set plus shipping. Discount with two or more sorry for the miss print.


----------



## drifterfisher

lagoon charters said:


> Lol I hear ya there. Not bad though figured it would
> be my last lol ya right....its an addiction.
> 
> $415 per set plus shipping.


So $830 plus shipping,hell my whole boat aint worth that..
Matter of fact I just sold a boat motor and trailer for only $550 and it was in very good running condition.One day I'll,nah I'll be poor fer the duration.


----------



## lagoon charters

Well just finished up today. Gonna go for the first trip tonight. Will post some pics.


----------



## X-Shark

lagoon charters said:


> Well just finished up today. Gonna go for the first trip tonight. Will post some pics.


In the Monsoon?

Let me ask...... Are you left handed? I ask because of the way your boat is set up.


----------



## lagoon charters

X-Shark said:


> In the Monsoon?
> 
> Let me ask...... Are you left handed? I ask because of the way your boat is set up.


I am left handed for writing but do everything with my right lol if that makes since. Raining here like a cow wetting a rock but Looks like its gonna blow out soon. Guys been giging 15-20 a night around the spool island.


----------



## X-Shark

The reason I said anything is the side you have your Trolling motor on.


----------



## lagoon charters

Well its a remote control ... I got it remote so could run it from the poling platform. On the east coast. Vero Sebastian area not much rain normal evening stuff. Water probly off color but you got to go when you can. Should be able to find some clear water around the inlet.


----------



## X-Shark

My experience with a remote control was that it was to jerky of steering for Floundering.

Would have been fine for Bass fishing.


----------



## jcall

Hello,
Your set up looks on point! I think the flounder will just give up when they see this rig! Looking forward to more pics.


----------



## lagoon charters

X-Shark said:


> My experience with a remote control was that it was to jerky of steering for Floundering.
> 
> Would have been fine for Bass fishing.


I don't use the Trolling motor for floundering that's what the air motor is for lol.


----------



## The Barb

Hello Again,my motor came in,14hp Kohler,also ordered and received a 34inch 3 bladed prop from arrow prop,wood,hub,have not put on the motor yet,it looks small for the motor,The Tech at arrow prop said it should be all I need,my concern is it looks small,What size is your Prop????? all I will use it for is floundering,to keep from poleing,still trying to figure out my steering,??????? Thanks for all your imput


----------



## lagoon charters

The Barb said:


> Hello Again,my motor came in,14hp Kohler,also ordered and received a 34inch 3 bladed prop from arrow prop,wood,hub,have not put on the motor yet,it looks small for the motor,The Tech at arrow prop said it should be all I need,my concern is it looks small,What size is your Prop????? all I will use it for is floundering,to keep from poleing,still trying to figure out my steering,??????? Thanks for all your imput


What pitch is the prop?? I went with the 36" 3 blade composite for weight reduction with a 13 pitch.. sounds ok depending on pitch. I tested mine out sunday night and it worked awesome... Steering was perfect was able to maneuer in and out of mangos easily. Had to disconect oil sensor kept wanting to shut off at low idle worked perfect after that... Were are you located.... I would be glad to take you out and demo so you can get the feel... Didn't focus to much on giging just wanted to get the feel for it we did see several reds


----------



## The Barb

I have not installed the Prop yet,I got it from ArrowProp,Talked to Mr. Miller upthere and told him what I was doing,he suggested I go with the 34P3A18,3-blade,he said it would be quieter and should be all I need with a 18 inch pitch? this is my first airmotor,I am not useing it for the power ( I have a outboard for it) just to push me across the bars for floundering,I have a 24volt trolling motor mounted upfront(center) which usually works fine but sometimes I get so shallow the prop of the trolling motor is slashing water,I have a severe bad back and unable to pole much,what I have works great just always trying to make eaiser,I will post some picts of my rig,see what you think,Im up in the panhandle,this will be my first airmotor,do you think a 18 pitch is OK???? I guess since it is still brand new I can exchange it,but I know after I run it then I will have to keep it,we dont see alot of airmotors uphere,we have to work in and out around docks,I got the motor,prop,hub,ordered throttle cable and asserieries yesterday,still thinking about stick steering with teleflex???Are you happy with your actuator?I am going to have to make some sharp turns down beside docks,dont mind helping alittle with my gig but having to hold switch I think will be a problem for me,I need to make it and then be hands free,easing down beside dock,I kill alot of flounders laying underneath or beside of the dock poles?Im basically just wanting to ease along,in and out,trying to make it as easy as possible......,I am not able to do all the physical stuff anymore and unwilling to get off the water yet, still hanging on!!!!!!!!!


----------



## lagoon charters

HAD IT OUT FINALLY GOT A BREAK IN THE WEATHER STUCK 9 THE FIRST NIGHT WORKED AWESOME WOULD RECOMMEND SETUP TO ANYONE WHO FLOUNDERS WILL EVEN OFFER TO BUILD FOR THEM.


----------



## lagoon charters

I'LL post some fish pics when I email them from camera to my phone wife took pics with better cam. Lights were awesome like water not even there. 17-24" could have gigged 30+ sheepheads.


----------



## lagoon charters

Here is a few from Friday night. Saturday pics coming.


----------



## drifterfisher

Nice fish,thats what its all about.


----------



## drifterfisher

lagoon charters said:


> HAD IT OUT FINALLY GOT A BREAK IN THE WEATHER STUCK 9 THE FIRST NIGHT WORKED AWESOME WOULD RECOMMEND SETUP TO ANYONE WHO FLOUNDERS WILL EVEN OFFER TO BUILD FOR THEM.


The lights look like they do good,but you,well I would want some side light.2 more sets and you should be good....lol.


----------



## lagoon charters

Lol no way and more light and it will show up on radar.... That pics is in 4' of water at boat ramp with lights pointed down. I have better pics in shallow water on wife's cam haven't loaded them to pc yet. They are plenty bright. They really make the outline of a flounder glow. Got green coming for dirty water. Think I'm gonna make up a string for night fishing and shrimping. Gotta recoup from build first. Weather been crappy here and been busy at work so I haven't been since last time.


----------

