# Swordfish: Are they really that picky?



## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

I've been wondering this a lot lately (especially since we have not been fishing much this year, thanks BP)....are swordfish really that picky?

I have read and heard much about how important a finely prepared "fresh" "food quality" squid is "mandatory" to catch swords.

After watching *Swords Life on the Line, *seeing that they basically put less effort in to baiting and prep than most white trout fisherman on the 3MB, if we are all putting too much effort in to bait these things.

Not to say no effort - but less effort. A few articles I have seen recently read talk about using fresh dead butterflied baits (any fish; hardtail, dolphin, skipjack, etc.) or belly baits with skirts over them. This to me seems like less effort and better durabilty. Squid are delicate, messy, and not able to withstand much abuse above or below the water. Not to mention expensive.

I think I am done with squid, unless I catch some fresh ones on the grounds.

Any thoughts from anyone with real expeirence (Chris V, Downtime, etc.)?


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## Xanadu (Oct 1, 2007)

If I'm not mistaken, swords have hit every type of bait we've ever tried. Dead macks to 3' dyed squid and even live bait. If they are there, they'll eat.


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## Travis Gill (Oct 6, 2007)

Squid out of the boxes you can buy anywhere work fine. I have done it with the fancy rigging and also just putting a couple smaller squids on the hook and I really dont think it matters


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## Heller High Water (Nov 1, 2007)

I have heard stories of the guys on the rigs catching swords on bake potatoes and fried chicken.


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## Captain Woody Woods (Oct 2, 2007)

Swordies are like big saltwater vacuum cleaner catfish. Last one we caught was on like 3 foot tentacle of some giant squid we found floating dead. Caught em on live bait, strips from blackfin bellies, etc. I just like taking the time to sew squid some afternoons. Just a pride thing I guess to see a bait I spent a few minutes making look pretty get sucked down. The important part is making sure you're in the right area with a good amount of bait. There's all kinds of little tricks you can mess with (how close your light is to the bait, what depth you are fishing at, what color light, etc.) that can tweak your hookup to catch ratio but that's the fun part is learning what works. Next time you have a successful trip, take the time to write down how deep the bait was, how far the light was from the bait, what kind/color light did you use, what time was the strike, what moon phase it was, what water depth you were in, what bait you were using, etc. You will start to notice trends, I promise. And then you can capitalize. Good luck


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## team_A_II (Mar 31, 2009)

I'm with Woody on this one. I have found that the right bait/color combo is only one of many factors. Moon phase, current, depth, etc. all have a much larger influence on your success, but it is super important to have a presentable bait. I dont see the point in running the long distances to our sword grounds and investing all the time and money only to half ass your bait spread. I find the more effort you put into it the better your chances become. I almost never used un-dyed squid anymore, and take careful time preparing the squid to make sure they flow naturally with the hook in them. Granted, they sometimes they will eat almost anything... but most times you will find they can also be very picky. We often pull up slashed squid from swords (mostly pups) just running through the bait around your lights just murdering everything in sight, but not really eating. So in short, I do think its important to put effort into your bait selection, but I believe there are larger factors that determine your success out on the grounds.


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## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

*Where they live?!?!*

Thanks all for your input. 

If i sense a theme here.... Fish where the fish are!!?!

It has been posed by many others, with far more experience than I, that offshore fishing is really more about being at the right place at the right time. 

Like in marlin fishing, usually lure selection is more important to fisherman than fish. I will be betting the same with swordfishing. Literally and figuratively. 

Again, I am not suggesting to " half-ass" it. But, I personally feel that enough evidence has been compiled by many people out there that a strip bait or live hardtail presented where they are is the most important factor. Sure a pretty squid will, and does take them, but IMO not worth it for me. 

I just wish I had more time to confirm/debunk my theory. If I am lucky and can get the time, crew, money, and weather to pan out 6 times per year I am lucky. I just don't get the chance to be on the grounds as much as others here. Thanks for the feedback. 

Now, the real question is and always will be......where are they?


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## Chris V (Oct 18, 2007)

No, they aren't that picky but how you rig your baits can ultimately decide whether the fish that bites gets hooked, and once hooked will stay on throughout the fight. A longliner is using a line 30 miles long with over a thousand hooks and soaking them for a very long time. In a 10 hour set a good haul is around 30 fish. You can't fish that many hooks over that far of an area and very rarely for that long so make sure that the bait he sees looks like the greatest thing in the world. I've hooked swords on squid, northern and spanish macks, live and dead hardtails, goggle eyes, and even crazy fish. I used to rig some of my baits really fancy and this and that and have ultimately settled on rigging options that take far less time but the main thing I still pay attention to is that the hook is unobstructed and the bait looks natural. I know plenty of guys who will string 5 or 6 small squid on a hook and have had luck with that as well BUT in my experience doing this when a sword bites or whacks the bait with its bill the smaller squid can slump down the hook and the point is unable to penetrate. You get a runoff but the fish shakes the hook once he feels the pressure. While its cool just to get a bite (I guess) I'd much rather him be dead on the deck. 

I like the KISS strategy on everything but don't get caught with a report saying "went 0-3" because of half assing something as simple as prepping a bait. Sharpen hooks, rig your baits, pay attention to how they look in the water and you will CATCH more swords.


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## Xanadu (Oct 1, 2007)

Your original post asked if they were picky and the answer is no, not really.

But, as Chris pointed out, catching them isn't just a matter of getting them to try to bite. Catching them is much more difficult than making them hit so while I said they'd eat anything, it's important to know they're not going to get hooked up unless the bait is rigged correctly.

Swords are sloppy fish. They're clumsy and they've got a big sword on their head and eyes on the side so they don't see so well in front of them. Rigging a bait needs to be done just as much for enticing the bite as it is to get the hook in their mouth.

For that reason, almost every bait we fish is going to be a large squid stitched with a straw/beads to get the hook exactly where it needs to be so it isn't missed or fouled in the bait.


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## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

X and CV,

I agree that the bait regardless needs to be rigged right. Hook placed appropriately, fresh, presented right depth, as natural as possible, etc. 

My beef is really that I hate squid. There I said it. They stink are expensive for the big ones, pain in the ass to rig, too delicate on hook. 

As said before, swords are like a 2 year old with an ice cream cone in 95 degree sun! They know they want to eat it but fumble getting it in the piehole!

That being said I like my odds of a whole fresh dead fish, fresh "properly" rigged panama ( which done correctly is as timely and skillful as squid!) when a sword is trying to eat a bait. She can whack it many times and be reasonably assured that it is still there and intact. If they do not get hooked I can probably leave it down with the hope that sooner or latter they get it right. If I also rig with a glow skirt over it and do loose the meat, it may still be enough for her to think to come back for the leftovers. 

Ok now that we have everyone thinking here.....circle or j hook? 

That should get any lookers riled up to jump in now!? LOL.


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## team_A_II (Mar 31, 2009)

As for the Circle or J hook Question, your starting a debate that can go on forever. There are a lot of factors involved, and a lot of personal preference, for some good sword answers ask the guys at the www.swordfishingcentral.com forum, or just browse through the old posts, all these questions have been debated and answered a billion times there. Its a great place to go for answers, check it out. :thumbup:


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## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

I know. But I am curious what hooks most are using locally. As you know sometimes tackle preferences are regionalized. Heck, there can be big differences in the way people fish/rig between the areas ( fl/al/ms/la) that comprise this forum.

Been to SWC many times. You're right it is a good resource.


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## Xanadu (Oct 1, 2007)

If you want to catch them, then a modified J hook that is bent to increase the offset is your best bet. Say a 12/0 Hays or 7691 bent out 12 degrees should be about right. Lord only knows where the hook will find purchase from the eye to the side to the tail or the line could even just loop the fish around the body several times and catch itself. 

A Charlie Brown 22 or 24 circle is a good bridle hook if you use the ones with the welded ring with a dead or live bait, but not so much with squid. Having the big hook exposed or even under a skirt in front of a bridled live bait concerns me because of the light so I tend to stick with squid and j-hook.


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## team_A_II (Mar 31, 2009)

I fish Jobu J hooks, 10/0 or 11/0 on my tip rods, and usually on the squid on the float rods. Squid are the go to bait for us, and use them on almost all rods except for the live bait rods. For live bait, I use eagle claw circle C circle hooks 19/0 on bigger hardtails, and 18/0 on slightly smaller live baits. I really dont like using J hooks on live baits not only for bridling reasons, but foul hooking becomes a problem when with live baits and J hooks. Hope this helps.


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## Travis Gill (Oct 6, 2007)

Double J hooks. Snell one and leave the tag end the ength of your squid and crimp the second one on, hook the first one through the front of the squid (end without tentacles) and run the second through the same hole as your first and out the back of the squid and hook it through the middle of the head so your leader between hooks is inside the mantle of the squid. Might hook them outisde the mouth but the end result is the same......dead swordfish


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## Chris V (Oct 18, 2007)

I've made up my mind on the hooks and since changing my style of rigging and hooks we haven't lost a hooked sword since. 

Squid make up the majority of a swords diet so they are a part of life for someone who swordfishes. I think the article you read was more inclined to deep dropping during the day in which case I too say use a fresh baitfish or belly strip but we have something here that I've never had as much of a problem with down there; SHARKS and lots of them. I've used belly strips twice and thats gonna be the last time I use them since those big brown and gray bastards are all we caught on them. Now, day dropping I would use them though for the durability factor but I will never use them again for night fishing up shallow.

I use smaller squid than a lot of folks use, usually around 9-12 inches total and to save money on swordbaits I get a flat of squid and pick out the ones in the best shape. A 25lb flat yields a lot of swordbaits as long as it isn't a bottom of the barrel flat. Save the rest of the squid for bottom fishing.


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## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

CV

Interesting observation. You're right that most of the articles are using non-squid baits. I am assuming that since we fish pm hence shallower than am deepdropping that is why you feel sharks are more of a problem. I guess that is plausible. Also sharks are more active at night that probably adds to the likelihood. 


I wonder why sharks don't seem to eat your squid baits? They eat mine. I really can't say if sharks are more inclined to eat baits vs squid. Could be?!?

One thing that seems to be apparent from seeing the swords life on the line show is that they when they catch sharks they are in the "wrong" water. 

Maybe sharks eating baits are a result of fishing wrong water? Just curious...did you catch any swords that time you used bait? Has that been replicated?

Not saying that I have the right answers here but kinda hard to be definitive without a fair shot at both options. If you fish squid more often than baits, you statistically will catch.....more swordfish. 

I guess that is why we are all fishing and not catching!


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## Chris V (Oct 18, 2007)

JMB said:


> CV
> 
> Interesting observation. You're right that most of the articles are using non-squid baits.


Thats not really the point I was making. What I meant by pointing out those articles is that most of them dealt with day fishing for swords which is completely different. 

Not nearly as many large sharks live at the depths you swordfish during the day which is easy to see why a strip bait would be the better solution.

Oh yeah, sharks do eat my squid as well but not nearly as much as a strip bait or mackeral. I think the oil in them helps drive sharks nuts. Like I said earlier, the 2 times I used strip baits resulted in a shark filled throwdown.


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## Travis Gill (Oct 6, 2007)

You cant really compare the way we fish here recreationally to long lining the Northeast. It is 2 completely different types of fishing and @ completley different geographic regions. I like using squid and do like Chris said just get a box or flat and pick out the good ones. Ive had 5lb boxes where every squid was the right size just look before you buy.


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## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

I got what you were saying. I didn't convey my point well. Been typing on my iPhone, out of town on work. 

I was agreeing with you on daytime is so deep that not as likely to encounter sharks. Makes sense. 

Freespool: they are two different types of fishing and different locations. But I can learn from many methods and locations to help me be a better fisherman. After all they are the same fish and their locations are different but the actual fish and habits are probably much closer than most fisherman think. 

A good example of that is I grew up fishing for tuna off the area that they film that show. Spreader bars have been in use to catch tuna for many years. I have been using spreader bars here and catch them here too. Just now 25 years later. GOM fisherman starting to acknowledge the method. But many people discount that tactic here. Because it is not what "we" do here. Not because the fish are so different. 
Another example of this is marlin. Because guys fish for marlin in HI means I can not learn and apply tactics to GOM marlin? Same fish essentially. Should act and respond similarly. Not exact but very close. Fish are like people. There are many examples of this in fishing. When people first started to use freshwater lures like spinnerbaits for redfish people said that won't work. Different fish, fresh vs salt. And guess what guys that caught on early caught the sh_t out of them. Now it is standard issue for any guy on the redfish tour. 

So I understand we do have to consider some differences, I am trying learn from other sources. And knowing what I know from my actual experiences and from what I have learned from many others experiences through people who make a living from fishing. Recreational (authors, journalists, capts, you guys, etc.) or commercial.


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## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

There is a lot we can learn from each other if we are willing to think outside business as usual mentality and try news tactics. 

Could not proof read on the iPhone. Disregard the " Fish are like people" line. Started a point and went another way. Thats what u get typing with fat fingers and small screen.


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## Matt Mcleod (Oct 3, 2007)

Do everything Chris V says and you'll be on the right track. I don't know him but from reading these posts he's seen swordfish on the deck and not just read about it in sportfishing magazine. Good luck, it can become addictive!


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## Chris V (Oct 18, 2007)

In that case Matt, I say swim down 100ft with scuba gear at night with a knife in your teeth and a shield in the other hand with a glow stick taped to every limb. Do this and make sure you give plenty of motion to the glow sticks and you will truly earn a swordfish.......if he doesn't kill you first

There are many guys on here that know a great deal about swords and have probably seen more on deck than I have but regardless of how it gets done I think keeping it from getting too complicated is the best thing. Theres no doubt you can learn new things here by adopting them from other areas but the way longliners do it in the NE is a "strength by numbers" game that we can afford as recreational anglers. I fish 5-6 lines at a time for swords and if I could fish more without fear of disaster I would. 

Off subject, it hasn't taken spreader bars 25 years to get here. I've been fishing them as long as I've been offshore fishing and learned to pull them from other, older gulf coast anglers. I will agree though that they aren't as popular.

This thread has turned into a good one JMB, good job


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## Travis Gill (Oct 6, 2007)

Chris do you fish 6 lines without getting tangled too often? What about clearing when one bites? I usually just fish 3 but would try more if I had confidence it wouldnt turn into a huge [email protected]#$


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## Chris V (Oct 18, 2007)

Have only had one incident involving a tangle (the last one we caught actually). The main objective before setting is talking with crew and making sure everyone is in-the-know about what to do when the bite happens. As long as that is understood and the guys have good reaction speed, there shouldn't be a problem.


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## Water Boys (Aug 13, 2009)

Guys, I have been wanting to try this. I am not asking for anyone's hot spots, but where do you suggest a beginner try first? Nipple, Elbow, Spur???


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## JMB (Jan 2, 2009)

*"This thread has turned into a good one JMB, good job "*

Thanks.....I think?

I'm going back to being a voyeur!!!

If you all want to look at somethng, try this: http://www.sportfishingmag.com/gulfswordrigs

Some "know it all" got written up in a mag and now swears by...squid.

Just kidding, it is a good article and great instruction. I have used this instructions myself, thanks. 

Couldn't resist poking at you CV. I know you would never direct anyone to this page, due to people taking it as egotistical. So I am doing it for you.

As stated in my opening thread I wanted to hear from people who truly have real (or reel) experience. It looks like I have gotten that and them some.

Thanks.

For the record.....I hate squid!


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## Cast-N-Call (Apr 21, 2009)

Chris, you did not give them the secret bait. Remember the one with whiskers. Very informative thread.


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## Chris V (Oct 18, 2007)

Cast-N-Call said:


> Chris, you did not give them the secret bait. Remember the one with whiskers. Very informative thread.


HA! I almost forgot. Hardy bastards too, you can catch a sword on them and probably use 'em again.

JMB, there is a link to a bridle rig on there but to be honest I don't even use that type of rig anymore. It stays tough on a bridle and resists slumping down but it takes too much time IMO. 

AND YES, I meant good job in a good way. No better way to get the most info and tactics than to stir up a good debate


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